Loneliness is setting in...

[Ian Mack]

This isn't for advice....I think I just need to get this out of my system. Rail at the injustice of it all. y'know, all that good stuff.

I'm living at this resort hotel right now. I work there, I get cheap cheap rent and cheap food. So it isn't bad...

I've now been here for 8 months. I took a small 'vacation' last weekend to the city because things felt like it was getting too routine. It was a good time, I stayed at a Fairmont, saw some art, some animals at the zoo, some animals playing live jazz (the drummer was priceless), and danced to some house music while Ninja Scroll, of all things, played on the screen @ a club. However, by the third day, as I was jumping an overpass in an effort to make it to the tattoo shop, I realized that something was missing.

I couldn't figure it out immediatly but I'm starting to think that as good as the weekend was, it would have been much more if I had someone to share it with. And there it is. Since I have been out here, I have met two people who could paint, three people who could draw, and nobody that does it on a regular basis. I have alot of acquantances; people that I play videogames with, drink with, people that I climb mountains with...but no one who I can call a close friend.

Yet, as much as I want to have a close friendship, I can't seem to make it happen. Either they lack interest, or I lack interest. It is the same with girls that I'm interested in. It never seems to click right.The ones that are interested in me, I'm not. The ones I'm interested in, are not feelin' it. I've met alot of girls here but only two have gotten a reaction in me, a genuine "I need to get to know you better" feeling. But...no luck.

When I was a kid, I was really shy. When I was in High School, I was shy to everyone outside my circle of friends. When I got to college, I came out of my shell in that I could talk to anyone/anywhere for the most part.

Out here, I'm noticing that I really only have a couple of days a week when I feel genuinely social. I want to spend the rest of my time drawing. How in the name of God do you make a friend if all you want to do is draw? I'm not sure if I'm being too serious about my art, too focused, or if it's a matter of my shyness towards people. I'm seriously starting to wonder if I'm lacking in some social skills. It's like I have no charisma at all. Nobody wants to get to know me because I'm always drawing and they don't understand it so they leave me alone.

I should be okay with this but the heart is sad even as the mind tells it to buck up, "This is a beautiful place".

Well, if you've read this far...than you might as well say something. If you're an artist, you have to have a bit of a psychologist in ya!

[Dan1989]

I can relate alot to what you are saying. I have alot of personal problems in my life so I'm not exactly the best person to give advice... all I can tell you is that if you love art so much you have to give certain things up. That's not to say an artist can't have a fulfilling social life or friends though... if all else fails you could talk to a counselor about your problems, just hang in there

[silverslash]

seems like a really sucky situation, best advice i can give is start doing social activities where your bound to meet people with the same abilities, take a couple art classes at a nearby school or something for example.
two birds with one stone you get to draw and potentially meet people

-jose

This isn't for advice....I think I just need to get this out of my system. Rail at the injustice of it all. y'know, all that good stuff.

I'm living at this resort hotel right now. I work there, I get cheap cheap rent and cheap food. So it isn't bad...

I've now been here for 8 months. I took a small 'vacation' last weekend to the city because things felt like it was getting too routine. It was a good time, I stayed at a Fairmont, saw some art, some animals at the zoo, some animals playing live jazz (the drummer was priceless), and danced to some house music while Ninja Scroll, of all things, played on the screen @ a club. However, by the third day, as I was jumping an overpass in an effort to make it to the tattoo shop, I realized that something was missing.

I couldn't figure it out immediatly but I'm starting to think that as good as the weekend was, it would have been much more if I had someone to share it with. And there it is. Since I have been out here, I have met two people who could paint, three people who could draw, and nobody that does it on a regular basis. I have alot of acquantances; people that I play videogames with, drink with, people that I climb mountains with...but no one who I can call a close friend.

Yet, as much as I want to have a close friendship, I can't seem to make it happen. Either they lack interest, or I lack interest. It is the same with girls that I'm interested in. It never seems to click right.The ones that are interested in me, I'm not. The ones I'm interested in, are not feelin' it. I've met alot of girls here but only two have gotten a reaction in me, a genuine "I need to get to know you better" feeling. But...no luck.

When I was a kid, I was really shy. When I was in High School, I was shy to everyone outside my circle of friends. When I got to college, I came out of my shell in that I could talk to anyone/anywhere for the most part.

Out here, I'm noticing that I really only have a couple of days a week when I feel genuinely social. I want to spend the rest of my time drawing. How in the name of God do you make a friend if all you want to do is draw? I'm not sure if I'm being too serious about my art, too focused, or if it's a matter of my shyness towards people. I'm seriously starting to wonder if I'm lacking in some social skills. It's like I have no charisma at all. Nobody wants to get to know me because I'm always drawing and they don't understand it so they leave me alone.

I should be okay with this but the heart is sad even as the mind tells it to buck up, "This is a beautiful place".

Well, if you've read this far...than you might as well say something. If you're an artist, you have to have a bit of a psychologist in ya!

[NoUseFrAName]

relationships are about alignment...not about setting a collision course for eachother.
Life is not about just art, but art is totally about all life.

you gotta get out and experience the real world...it helps to give relevance to the art you create.

and when you're on the subject of love...if there's anything I've learned, it's that unconditional love is where it's at. To care any less about the people you hike/drink/game with than for some potential gf is to miss out on a lot.
Once I started making an effort to love all the relationships I already had without abandon, not only did it enrich my insight into the awesomeness that pretty much everyone has to offer, it also created circumstances that were more favourable for the development of other types of relationships.
And when the love is unconditional, there's no pressure for anything to happen...there's no dissappointment when a relationship doesn't progress to a more intimate level...because it's not based on the condition of the relationship...it's about alignment...
...loving in the way that's most fruitful in terms of enriching the lives of others.
Even distance has no effect...distance is merely a condition.
I've made amazing friends, only to see them leave town for months or years at a time...and then when we meet again, things are just as genuine...
...and for as much as we like to have people to share our joy with, it's just as fulfilling to reach out and genuinely share in the joys of others.

-Rob

[bizarre]

just be friendly. the people you meet don't have any idea what you've been through, and probably don't care. only tell them about the future, not the past. they probably won't care if you saw a rock concert a month ago. if you say you're going to one in a week, there's... i dunno.

i can't give advice, you didn't ask for it.

my sympathies. loneliness, of all kinds, sucks.

[gruve24]

Recently I talked to my college buds about the same problem your having. I'm starting to feel the effects of loneliness myself. I find its easy to make friends and get people to like me, but I don't genuinely reciprocate the same feelings towards them. When I was at school (an art school) i didn't have the problem I'm having now because I was surrounded by people who had similar interests as I do.

In my case I find I get along and am most happy around other artists, but I need to be friends wih someone first on a non-artistic level. I think the San Francisco workshop made me realize that.

Even though I was hyped to learn about art and be surrounded by other dedicated artists and the industry professionsals, I found myself wanting to learn more about the people and their other interests (non-art related). Eventually I get to a point where I know someone enough to have an idea of their person and then as a bonus connect with them on a more creative level.

There was someone at the workshop who I met. I think their going to a really good school in California now, but I remember them saying...It's not about the art, it's about people...and then by accident I just happened to look through his portfolio and his work turned out to be awesome! I think thats what made me have even more respect for the kid and opened my eyes to the types of people that I relate well with in this world. Because of his humbleness and character not only did I appreciate their talent but I appreciated them and felt like there was more to a person than just, "how good you are".

[USER777]

Recently I talked to my college buds about the same problem your having. I'm starting to feel the effects of loneliness myself. I find its easy to make friends and get people to like me, but I don't genuinely reciprocate the same feelings towards them. When I was at school (an art school) i didn't have the problem I'm having now because I was surrounded by people who had similar interests as I do.

In my case I find I get along and am most happy around other artists, but I need to be friends wih someone first on a non-artistic level. I think the San Francisco workshop made me realize that.

Even though I was hyped to learn about art and be surrounded by other dedicated artists and the industry professionsals, I found myself wanting to learn more about the people and their other interests (non-art related). Eventually I get to a point where I know someone enough to have an idea of their person and then as a bonus connect with them on a more creative level.

There was someone at the workshop who I met. I think their going to a really good school in California now, but I remember them saying...It's not about the art, it's about people...and then by accident I just happened to look through his portfolio and his work turned out to be awesome! I think thats what made me have even more respect for the kid and opened my eyes to the types of people that I relate well with in this world. Because of his humbleness and character not only did I appreciate their talent but I appreciated them and felt like there was more to a person than just, "how good you are".

good posts in here.. nice reading.
i can relate to a lot of what has been said in here.
i, too, am very dedicated and spend a lot of time with drawing and the sorts. my problem is, that there are not many (actually only one person) that does ANY sorts of drawing and with who i can talk about art and stuff.

it often is not hard to get on with most people you just meet and smalltalk with, but it is often the case (at least in my experience) that these people actually have very little interests except doing sports or going to parties.
i have met very few people who have SOME broader education in terms of culture, politics, science and so on. a lot of people i know who i could spend an evening with, go outside and drink or smoke some weed, those are the ones i couldn't have any sort of longer conversation of any sorts with.

thinking too much about all this stuff kinda isolates me from having too much to do with those people, just because i can not relate to them on a "not smalltalk" level.

whatever, it's nice to hear that some people out there have basically the same problems as i have. we should all meet some time and bore the hell outta each other

[John]

Well, if you've read this far...than you might as well say something. If you're an artist, you have to have a bit of a psychologist in ya!

Yeah, kind of. I'm 23 now, i was in the same position when i was 15. I think friends are pretty much one of the most important things there are, so here goes.
Anyway, the most important thing to start with is that you can only rely on yourself. You're the only person you have power over, and you should use that. If you're unhappy, find out why. If all you do is draw, you're bound to end up burned out. You need more to keep you happy. I personally need music, movies and books, philosophy, psychology, art, nature and games like those green things outside need the big yellow & bright thing.
Especially music is something that moves most people strongly. Go to concerts. Go to clubs, cafes and bars, but make sure you enjoy the place, if you hate the music chances are you won't like the people. Meeting people that mean something to you takes time and can't be rushed. When you have met people that are fun to be around for you, spend as much time as you can with them. With most of my friends, they just don't know a thing about art and that's fine. Sometimes you need to get away from it. Talk about music, movies and such, don't think of yourself as an artist. If those people don't know about art, they'll take you for the person you are and not the artist you want to be. Go eat pizza with them. If you don't think they are cool, dump them. Your friends should be the coolest persons you know.
It's actually pretty easy. If you enjoy fun things with fun people, and you don't misbehave, over time they'll become your friends. And if you and another person agree on many things you like, you may become good friends.
One more thing about music. Be specific about one band that owns them all. If another person thinks the same way, your friends already! Because bands are like opinions, they are totally meaningless and subjective.
Hope i don't just sound patronising or dumb Have fun, don't let people get you down.

[corky13]

I know how ya´ feel somehow. Im 18 now and i know most of my amigos since my 13s and we went a lot through together. But we aren`t young teenies anymore and most of my pals have a girlfriend (or boyfriend) now (don`t get me wrong= im very happy forthem. Its always good to see a friend whos is lucky...but i also get envy...Im the oldest of my amigos and never once had that kind of relationship... i hate myself for it (for being envy of course ) -,-°) and/or we just walked our own ways. And girls are freaked out by me (I draw a lot more or less crazy stuff and i listen to Metal (and not the yey hi Metal stuff like Linkin Park or how all the New agers are called) and i like Coding (Pascal , Delphi , HTML , Java ...no matter what...) -,-) And it seems the only girls that are interested in me are just dumb girlies with the age around 15 (NO !!! Stay away from me !) or pseudo-satan chicks with questionable opinions on life...and im shy and i look like sh....WOHA WHAT THE.....? OMG ! HOW RETARDED AM I ?!?! *stops mourning IMMEDIATLY*....

(After all its VERY important to keep long friendships alife. Nobody will understand you as much as a year long friend and nobody can give you a better advice than this friend.)

But i help myself out by listening music as often as i could helps to move on and focus on other thins (btw.: Anybody know BleedingThrough ? At first i was a bit sceptical about this Band but right now i can say that im very happy that i bought a CD ). Music is really the key to the human soul If nothing helps than listen to music you like and-....yeah you got it *throws in his BleedingThrough CD*

ok sorry...you can call me "crybaby" if ya want...

[darth massacre]

That's why birds of a feather flock together.

I try to attend parties and gatherings as often as I can. But usually I stick with people I am familar with and hang out often with them. With my buddies, we play paintball in a team and we're all solid into military stuff....so we have tonnes to talk about, what we read, what we experienced in the army (every male serves in Singapore).

I also tend to mix around well with fellow artists. Coz there's always something to talk about with fellow artists. It may be an argument, but its always rewarding to exchange views.

Its also kinda easy for me to talk to people who are older than me. May not have the maturity or their level of experience in life. But at times like these, its better for them to do the talking and we do the listening. So we can pick up on their errors and try not to repeat it. To be old and wise, you first have to be young and stupid...or you gotta be attentive and lucky

So I really don't feel lonely. I am interested in many things and I can hold my own in conversations with regards to sports, technology, health and science, politics, religion, art, personal issues and so on.

[GhostofMacbeth]

I can really relate in a lot of ways. I have always been relatively shy. I think I also send off this vibe of unapproachability or soemthing because people just don't seem to involve me in things. In my high school yearbook I had someone write something "You are really hard to get to know but you are really cool when I did." or something like that. I really don't know why, obviously. Through college I expeirienced mostly the same kind of thing. A couple of close friends, mostly "associates" that new me but really didn't hang out or ask me to come along etc. I didn't drive until late so I sort of had to rely on ther people asking some rather than being a dork and asking people to drive me places etc. I graduated from college. Kept a few close friends but not a whole lot. Drifted from some etc. Went to work, had the same kind of thing with people that know me but nothing else. Other people get asked to go to lunch all around me, I don't. It is weird but I just must have something to put people off. So basically I sit, I go to cafes, restaurants, whatever. I sit, eat, smile at passersby etc and nothing really clicks, I sit alone. I went to the concept art workshop and I got a similar vibe. People talked to in passing, etc but nothing much except the occassional "recognise, say hey, continue on" thing. True that I was older than most and all that but it is just weird that it always ends being alone. Right now I have my girlfriend, a few people I see a couple of times a year and e-mail (friends that moved away etc) and that is about it. Leaves tiem to do work but it sucks. It is just very hard to find friends for me.

[jayne]

i'm the same as you. im in high school right now and i'm pretty shy, i dont do much anyways. i have a wide variety of "friends" but like... i dont know any of them well. at all. i want to hang out with them but... they dont really seem to care. i really have ... well i'm trying to be more social now (trying to meet people down in socal thro the posts) but many haven't really taken a liking to me. i dont know i dont really know how to deal with them either. i just want u to know that ur not alone...

[Sorknes]

I've actually had the opposite problem... I've been a damn social kid, and youngster, and I ended up where I felt I was choked by all my friends, and my commitments for them. Since I after a while felt... well, yeah, that they were expecting things of me, and not just taking me as I am, fully and whole.

So I did the opposite thing, two and a half years ago I kicked out my old ex bf which I was living with, quit my job, and said buh-buh to the big city. Moved to be closer to my family, and went totally reclusive, and kept only those friends that could actually cope with the fact that I needed both change and time for myself. A lot of that time was used for drawing, after I'd given up drawing and painting for several years, my time just didn't stretch enough for me earlier.

Now I'm slowly building up a new circle of friends here, and I'm kinda picky with the ones I spend time with. I spend a lot of time drawing, but now I've at least gotten that time for myself I so desperatly needed, so I can also meet people. Even though I sadly enough still don't have any so called "artistic" friends that I can sit down and draw with and discuss my work with.

If you want advice on how to meet people, however, my first tip would be to sniff around for something where you can meet people on a weekly basis. If you have had any kind of hobby earlier you liked, where you feel you'd like to continue, if it's martial arts, soccer, readers circle, church meetings, LAN gaming, stamp collecting, model building, help the homeless, soup kitchen, support group for elders, or what. That way you get friends with somewhat the same interest as you, even though it's not drawing.

And secondly, chin up. When it comes to love, and finding the right one to take a level higher than just "friend", they appear when you least expect it.

Living a life, meeting people, and taste the real life is important, but also remember not to get too soaked up in it, like me, heh. Good luck.

[DSillustration]

this is why man invented pornography and alcohol.

[Knight of the Cross]

I know where you're coming from otherside. I'm just in high school and I have friends but no one that I feel close to. I walk my own road a lot of the time, which isn't bad, but I know how it feels to want to know someone more deeply.

I think people are intimidated by me... not sure why, but anyways, I think that more than trying to go out and find relationships you need to take everything as it is. Umm, I guess it's kinda like the whole to make friends you have to be a friend first. NoUseFrAName has explained it pretty well I think. Unconditional love really makes everything worthwhile. Reciprocation isn't always necessary.

Even still, to get closer to people: you just need to find yourself... um, like, strip away all the masks and facades that are normal for people to use as a way of fitting in or protecting themselves. Just show honest truth and feeling; people see a lot in that and I think that can really help you with your problems. But I guess to show others who you truly are you may need to slack off on the drawing (I never thought I say that...). Sacrifices need to be made in relationships- it's usually worth the effort though.

Hope my two cents helped. I feel I'm pretty insightful for a stupid high school kid, hehehe...

[darth massacre]

this is why man invented pornography and alcohol.

Well Porn and Alcohol can be social activities too

Lets not get into that.

[Johann de Venecia]

Other people get asked to go to lunch all around me, I don't. It is weird but I just must have something to put people off. So basically I sit, I go to cafes, restaurants, whatever. I sit, eat, smile at passersby etc and nothing really clicks, I sit alone. I went to the concept art workshop and I got a similar vibe.

Dude, that's heart-wrenching. *sob* It makes me sad reading your post. Bah! Forget people.

Seriously though, I know what you mean. Its good that youre reaching out, but its when you don't try so hard that it usually comes. So just chill.

[GhostofMacbeth]

I do that for the most part and it doesn't work so well either LOL

[Ian Mack]

Once I started making an effort to love all the relationships I already had without abandon, not only did it enrich my insight into the awesomeness that pretty much everyone has to offer, it also created circumstances that were more favourable for the development of other types of relationships.
And when the love is unconditional, there's no pressure for anything to happen...there's no dissappointment when a relationship doesn't progress to a more intimate level...because it's not based on the condition of the relationship...it's about alignment...

NoUse, you made a really good point. I'm definitely going to try this in the future. I'm going to think about alignment as well.

Thanks everyone, for replying. It's good to see that others feel the same way.

[BENC]

read this book -That's not what i meant! -by Deborah Tannen, basically it gives you a blow by blow account of how to tackle conversations with different people from family, frineds, spouses, colleagues etc.

[corky13]

ISBN Number ?

[BENC]

yeah that would help... sorry not really with it today.
ISBN-1-85381-512-8

[corky13]

thank you

[Blackhawk]

I do that for the most part and it doesn't work so well either LOL

I think in your situation Macbeth, you may need to take a much more proactive effort to meet and introduce yourself to strangers and just try to build some kind of rapport. It takes a lot of guts and balls to walk up to a stranger and strike up a random conversation for most people, it did for me for the longest time, but after you do it enough, it starts to become second nature. Just remember to be a listener, people love people that listen, whether it's girlfriends, friends, or strangers you meet in the cafe.

[Steph Laberis]

Wow, this is a really intense thread... or at least a very thoughtful one.

I find myself in that lonely place whenever I'm in transition, whether it's when I switch jobs or leave schools, etc. I try to be perky and don't really have trouble making new friends, despite persistant anxiety and insecurities - it's establishing the trust that's toughest, especially when jobs and schools have expiration dates on them.

I've found you can have all the number of friends in the world to smile for, drink with and socialize with, but if you don't take anchor in a couple of the special ones, it's really damn lonely.

My heart goes out to you guys in this thread. We've all been there.

And yes... "alignment" is the word here. I've tried way too many times to be on a collision course with people that just weren't right for me.

[ngnorden]

Just remember to be a listener, people love people that listen, whether it's girlfriends, friends, or strangers you meet in the cafe.

This is the key to interacting with people. To really listen and seek to understand a person, without thinking of the next thing to say as soon as the other person shuts his mouth, which would result in a meaningless bouncing of words and no real deep meaningful communication, each person spewing their autobiographies out on one another.

If you just listen to the person, and ask questions when you don't understand, without thinking of how you are coming across, and not worrying whether you will have something to say, you have absolutely nothing to fear when approaching people, because you have the knowing that whatever happens I am honest in my communication, I am not hiding anything, and since I'm not hiding anything, I don't have the fear of being "found out" to not really listen to the other person.

This realisation has been such a breakthrough in my life. Today I met a person I found really intimidating, but when I approached I was totally relaxed, and my mind could be summed up with one word: CLEAR. Clear of all the bullshit, social masks and all that crap, and because I was relaxed and my mind was clear, conversation just flowed out and we had a great time and I could just be my natural self.

This isn't easy though.. it takes practise until it becomes a habit to listen and to be totally honest. Some days it comes without thinking, some days the ability comes and goes, and some days are just filled with bullshit.


It's funny how confrontation of other people is one of the biggest fears we have, and that everyone has it. Everyone goes around being (more or less) afraid of each other, and we think we're the only one in the world being afraid. Just being aware of this can help you tremendously sometimes.

there's so much more I want to write... but... any more lines will result in this being an essay and not a forum post.

take care y'all /N

[Ian Mack]

Right on, I know what you mean about trust. I keep finding myself thinking that these people are just moments in my life.
...
I don't think it helps. They are moments but what is contained in that moment is equal to something greater.

Being more proactive is a good suggestion. I'm going to make the effort to visit more people, hang out with them and have fun. While sacrificing as little drawing as I can.

At the same time though, I'm going to be picky about who I hang out with, keeping in mind the point about alignment.

[stoph]

im not at all lonely. thats not to say i havent experienced the bad times or shared the same struggles you guys have, though. i dont cling to my art as a way of life, nor do i rely on it to justify my existence. dont get me wrong, i love all things creative, yet id sooner give reverence to the Creator of the creative, you get me?

i understand that its not everyones cup of tea (still, dont flame me for subscribing to a different worldview ). either way, i find great meaning and purpose in God, cause frankly Hes the only unchanging, unconditional and permanent fixture in my life. He isnt temporal like friends or family or possessions. i believe He created man to be an interactive, intimate creation. He created us to be in commune with Him. our sense of loneliness spawns from a yearning for something of substance and fulfillment that is otherwise lacking in our lives, ie. a relationship with one's Creator.

meh, my two cents worth. hope it meant stuff to someone

[NoSeRider]

When I was a kid, I was really shy. When I was in High School, I was shy to everyone outside my circle of friends. When I got to college, I came out of my shell in that I could talk to anyone/anywhere for the most part.

Y'know why I was shy? Because teenagers are mean little pecker heads.

Took me along time to figure out the most neurotic people you'll ever meet will be people in High School.

Don't ever judge yourself upon experiences in High School. If I had to do it all over again, I'd opt to being home schooled.

I just find people are more accepting and less judgemental as you get older....provided you become more accepting and less judgemental.

[Dizon]

When I was a kid, I was really shy. When I was in High School, I was shy to everyone outside my circle of friends. When I got to college, I came out of my shell in that I could talk to anyone/anywhere for the most part.

I'm the same as you are man. I'm a notoriously quiet and shy person especially when I was in High School. I found it hard to make a lot of friends since most aren't into the same interests I like. Hated it as well, made me realize that i live in a cruel world haha. I think it's also due to the fact that people tend to go along with what's hip, I'm the total opposite. But isn't that boring?

I think NoseRider is right about people being "less judgemental" as we grow up. It's kind of strange but nice. And that we shouldn't judge ourselves based on our HS exp's hehe. Although it's hard getting rid of our emotional scars...

Doing art and being surrounded by its environment makes me comfortable. It's like I live in my own little world. As long as I do what I love then hopefully I'm fine heh.