The Royalty Problem - News: Brad got paid from TAD

[Sorknes]

So. I have been watching this taking a backseat, basically provided people that I deal with in the art communities with links to whatever and whereever things have been said. And I've been happy with that. I left this place a good while ago, together with a lot of outstanding people that basically made this place what it was, back in the days.

After taking a look again after the last hours, I actually did the effort of digging up the password to the place where I started my online art adventure, participated in challenges to get better, was once a mod, and did texting for online tutorials. I have a lot of good memories, lot of things to thank this place for, but unfortunately all the people I owe the thanks and memories to are gone. For several reasons.

Why did I bother doing that after years? Because I have nothing to lose. I am actually not in the business. I am neither a big name in the industry, nor a small one. I do not have any NDA to keep. Nothing I say will affect me in any capacity workwise. The information I am gonna post is not given by «I heard that possibly this person had/did/said» or one person alone. Some of the things I and other have learned over the years I cannot post, as it would be dragged into the whole "slander" thing that seems to be ok to do here as long as it is done to certain individuals.

First of all: The only person that keeps dragging CA through the mud is the founder himself and his actions. There is no «movement» trying to shut down CA, there is no «they» that try to ruin his life, but there is a number of people that is not gonna associate themselves with him any more because of his ways and behaviour. Many of whom was the key to build CA, giving freely of their knowledge, time and effort (which equals money in this business), but cannot even come back to delete their informative posts in CA (read: intellectual property) and keep them in others when they don't want to be associated with this place today because they are banned.

Second: Internet has changed. What was before contained to CA and its members is not any more. Back in 2009 as so many keep referring to, social media for one, was not as developed as it is today. Believe me when I say that whatever is said in this thread alone has basically no impact on what is said in other places. Nor in the information shared between individuals. Which is a lot more than comes to light in this thread. Information I mean.

Third: Do not think any of what you do in this community, be it hidden forums or private messages, is in fact not scrutinized. There is one person doing this, and it has been brought to light by several individuals. Users here in the know have been exchanging emails for years knowing this. People has been banned for things said in PM's.

Fourth: Do not think anything you have done for this community, post wise, knowledge wise, time wise or any other wise gets you on the plus side if one thing is found going against what is the current mantras. People that has spent more hours into giving feedback, knowledge, C&C, making tutorials than you have ever spent on this forum is currently not allowed to access their own intellectual property.

Fifth: The only mob mentality I have seen in this current case is here on CA. Any other place it is individuals sharing their experiences, having what looks to me mostly civil conversations, and in general trying to find out what this has to say to where they stay on a number of cases today. That said, I am sure I am not participating in all art communities or social medias online, but I can honestly say that I have not seen any lynch mob anywhere other a few very annoyed people that is telling about their past experiences.

Sixth: The contract Brad wrote was with CA, not TAD. TAD and John English paid. You can read about this from Brad himself. Or a number of other art communities. Or people reposting on FB. Or other social media. On another note, Jason was responsible for all this through TAD from what I can gather.

Seventh: Yesterday, there was three people that had gone public about not being paid. There was one mentioned in several places that I have not myself talked to personally, and a fifth that I know of myself. Brad is the only one I know for sure has gotten paid. Again, it's in several places. FB being one of them.

Eight: Two years is not late payment.

Ninth: There is people in TAD that should have supposedly been on the CC list that has no idea what is going on from what they are posting, again, you can look at Brads DA journal posts and go through the comments. Or other places. It's linked and reposted. A lot of places.

Tenth: Jason has earlier been claiming that CA was a not-for-profit/non profit organization, which is why it has an .org at the end. No documents of this has ever been found in the open registries (it basically means all economic transcations should be transparent), and no proof was ever given of this claim from Jason himself, which caused a lot of controversy, even though a lot of posts were made. And people were banned over question of proof.

Eleventh: Massive Black has nothing to do with this site any more, as far as I know. Jason «stepped down» from Massive Black, but kept tying this place riding Massive Blacks reputation.

Twelfth: Several of the early prominent members and co-founders have indeed been apologizing to members and users from the time they were in fact affiliated with Jason as the different relationships broke. There are people around still holding dear to their emails, but for obvious reasons cannot share them with the public. I being one of them.

Thirtheenth: Yes, there was a workshop that never happened.

Fourteenth: Yes, there are people that has been at workshops that hasn't been properly compansated or haven't got all that they were supposed to.

Fifteenth: It is a somewhat of a known fact that «public conversations» and «private conversations» with Jason is not just due to having a somewhat brash personality. There is proof of this floating around even though there's been efforts of getting rid of them.

Sixteenth: Any proof promised in this place to subdue any concerns will take forever to surface, to the point of where people forget about it and it is never produced. I can count three cases where I still have seen no proof that has been promised. I have not been looking around for it either, because I was expecting it to surface exactly where the concerns were mouthed. Unfortunately, these three concerns are all deleted from CA's database.

Seventeenth: There is a known history in this place where concerns will be left unanswered, specific questions will be deflected, blame will be thrown upon people banned and no longer able to answer for themselves, and yes indeed, the issues themselves will in their entirety disappear because the thread will be deleted either during a hot headed discussion, or later being silent about it.

Eighteenth: Yes, there was a blackout in 2009. During which several thread raising questions vanished, people were banned for asking legitimate questions, and some forums disappeared for while.

Ninteenth: Yes, there are censorship in this place. As the exodus of 2009 happened, C G H U B was one of the words being censored. Which from what I can read in this thread still is, or if it's not was just removed today. Three years later. Another place that could not be mentioned while I was active was G N O M O N, for years. A well renown art community/school that many people that posted here either worked for at the same time as they were here, or went to later. A third place after a falling out with the recruiter/head was also banned, but I cannot remember the name at the moment. Any place that has been a possible refuge for people not wanting to stay around, has had a history of being banned so current members cannot share information.

Twentieth: The rumours about the instructor list at TAD changing several months after the instructors themselves had removed themselves from Jasons project is true. Cease and decist letters had to be sent to take some of them down. People did indeed enlist thinking their instructors was going to be people that would never show up on TADs lectures. This was during a fallout with Massive Black and their friends. TAD today has nothing to do with this that I know of. Jason also is not actively doing anything with TAD today if I have my information right.

Twentyfirst: LMS, Last Man Standing, the art competition, not the killbook, was not a CA project. It was a project by Cody that Jason tried to take ownership of for CA.

Twentysecond: Yes, Shawn has made a statement. It is posted on Brads DA, and on FB by several people after emails because he cannot post in this community.

Twentythird: Yes, Jason has named and shamed people publicly and setting the community and forum trolls on them, without any other proof than «I said so».

Twentyfourth: That people torrent videos or that a download dwindles over time does not mean that you can stop paying the royalties of the legal downloads. No matter the amount.

Twentyfifth: Yes, there is a history of people being accused of things that has never been proved, with banning and shaming, that before the professional art community caught on to what was really going on in CA was indeed hurting both professionally and economically. Today, being named and shamed in this place really has no impact, from what I have heard. Because of all the earlier false accusations.

Twentysixth: This is a reply I made to a person in another community that I thought I might throw in for good measure: «If you think that if an artist is not paid from a company or a person that it is an issue that should be solely between the two parts (in this case Brad and Jason/CA/TAD), you are mistaken.
It is also an issue for the customers, and the potential customers. In this case the user base, members and students of CA/TAD.
You as another customer has no right to shush down an issue I as a customer might weigh heavily when it comes to if I want to purchase a product or not. If I want to boycott companies using kids making clothes, companies affiliated with organizations I myself do not share the values of, that sells products that is a health danger, or that is not paying their workers, that is my choice as a customer and consumer. That is my power. As a customer and consume
And for the record, the amount of money I couldn't care less about.

And in closing:

I am ashamed that there is people in this place, as it was the place I started out and learned all about how I should always get paid, that actually lets this slide no matter the amount of money concerned. Jason himself has been pretending to be an advocate on not doing work for free and always getting every cent you are ever owned. I do not care if the person in question was a billionare missing ten cents. You do not lecture others about business and then proceed not following your own rules.

[Main Loop]

If you're that worried about what other people you're saying in public places like this, maybe you should change what you're saying? But I also can't imagine an employer googling your username rather than your real name unless you've made it part of your own brand.... www.themainloop.com ooops. JK no one who buys my paintings cares about what I say on this forum

[paperX]

My name is Sterling Hundley and I am an Instructor at The Art Department (TAD), as well as the Director of The Art Department, Richmond. I have been heavily involved in the development of TAD, through participation in workshops, curriculum input, course development and other educational components. I am not writing this as a TAD representative, or as a professional artist, only as an individual who feels compelled to add clarity to this situation.

In such, I am writing, not in the defense of TAD as an institution, but in the defense of the character of John English, a long time colleague, a friend, and a mentor, who is the spine of this institution, and who has been the subject of the assumptions of detractors.

I have no record of being cc’d by Mr. Manley on any of this correspondence with Mr. Rigney, or vice versa- nor should I have been. I went through my records to make sure- the rhetoric Brad has stated that he was subjected to is infuriating, and if true, would stand as the type of thing that I would take action on. Brad, I apologize if I missed an opportunity to come to your defense in this.

It is well known that the entertainment industry is cut-throat, competitive and Brad’s situation wouldn’t come as much of a surprise in such and environment. This mindset is not well matched to the fostering of young, aspiring creatives, nor is it a wise practice to take advantage of the talent upon which such an educational model relies. John’s efforts have always been fair, in earnest, and in the best interest of his students and have never reflect such a mentality.

John English likely has had a more significant impact in the world of educating artists over the past fifteen years than any other single individual. Through The Illustration Academy, John has developed an incredible community of passionate artists, educators and students that have grown to rely upon one another in the pursuit of shared ambitions. He has created a program that assumes a level of integrity from its participants and that honors the history and professional lineage from which we all have come.

Mr. Manley has publicly proclaimed that he is stepping forward from management at TAD, much as I suspect he stepped forward from management at Massive Black and Brilliant Colors. To my knowledge, no TAD faculty is featured in the banner atop the ConceptArt.org website. As to the formal relationship between the two, I can only speculate.

I stand behind Mr. English, the TAD faculty, and students as we continue to move forward. I have no doubt that great things are to come now that TAD has vetted its affiliations.

Brad, thank you for bringing this to light. I wish the best of luck to you in your endeavors- truly.
--
p.s. Glad to see that John has made good on the payment.

Jason says he was not involved in the finances and did not know about Brad's situation because it was not "transparent" even though he was the President of TAD. He stated that he was notified by Brad "then immediately notified TAD's CEO and TAD Finance and later followed up with requests to see if anyone was still owed funds, and if so if payment arrangements had been made...numerous times".

TAD's CEO is John English, and he said it "has not been his personal position to deal with the royalty issues" which could mean either way on whether he knew about the issue or not. Ron and Sterling obviously supports John's position.

This certainly contradicts what Jason has said.

Someone or a group of people has dropped the ball along the line and no one wants to admit that they were even involved. If it ends up being "oh the accountant who handles royalty checks at TAD messed up" then I'm calling out bullshit, I doubt the finance department would be able to make the call to not pay so many artists. In case you didn't know, Brad was not the only one affected by this - pretty much everyone who has done tutorial videos for CA/TAD as suffered from this issue.

I'm happy that Brad finally got paid, but it's time we found out why this even happened in the first place. Many people like myself have spend hundreds of dollars supporting the tutorial videos because we believed our money would be used to help CA.org and the artists themselves. To find out that so many of them got shafted after so many years is like a slap in the face.

[skullsquid]

Thank you so much for eloquently putting all the issues in one place.

[Main Loop]

Thank you, Sorknes. Everyone should read your post.

[paperX]

Okies. A little tip for anybody who wants to make friends and influence people on the internet. Google your username. No, no kidding. Go ahead and do it. Every post you have ever made under that name on a public forum is there for millions of people to see. They will form an opinion of you based on what they can see.

That includes present and future employers and that cute girl in front of you in the queue for Starbucks. Every boring, arrogant, apologetic, argumentative or downright offensive statement you ever made on a public forum.

Now, I think that discussion is a healthy thing, but there will be (and will have been, looking back) things said here that maybe should be kept to signed-in members of this forum, rather than the whole big world-wide web.

I don't know. Is there a way that a mod can make this only viewable to signed-in members of CA?

Actually I specifically went out of my way to change my user title to my real name after posting in this thread. I'm not famous and I doubt anyone in the industry would give a shit what I think, but I believe this is a cause worth fighting for and will beneficial to artists and our industry as a whole. If future employers holds my actions to defend artist's rights against me then they're probably not worth working for anyway.

Also, this thread is pretty much the only place right now on the internet that others can go to get an idea of CA's side of the story, censor this and the community is pretty much going to be 100% forever condemned as villains in this whole affair.

...


I am ashamed that there is people in this place, as it was the place I started out and learned all about how I should always get paid, that actually lets this slide no matter the amount of money concerned. Jason himself has been pretending to be an advocate on not doing work for free and always getting every cent you are ever owned. I do not care if the person in question was a billionare missing ten cents. You do not lecture others about business and then proceed not following your own rules.

Amazing post.

[Fallenangel]

We are all talking about the supposed community, and the harm that this controversy does to the "community" and etc...

Jason has every right moral/legal to do whatever steps he feels are necessary to clear his name.
However, as i said before a legal document that supposed to come out at some point in the near/far future would not "heal" the community, and
unless the points that i raised in my original post would be addressed fully, this report would still be considered biased and obsolete and would not imo clear Jason's name either.
(it is too little and too late for that).

If you really want to show the community and the art world how to do it properly and maturely;
Get together, (even if the parties don't get along i think they can endure a 30 min conversation) have a conversation explaining what happened, what can be done to avoid these things in the future...etc.

I'm not interested in reading the entire TAD-Brad-Jason correspondence without any context provided by all the parties, i'm not interested in TAD's/Brad's/Jason's financial information, or some paper filled with legal jargon ...i'm sure that 90% of the community aren't interested in this either.

Cheers,
Fallen.


EDIT: After reading Sorknes' post, i have even less faith that this issue would be resolved in some normal manner...again.

[Raoul Duke]

I thought I knew the story until I read Sorknes' post.

[Anton Chigurh]

First of all I don't know Jason personally. I have seen his name first at sijun where he was sharing his art knowledge (his threads from 2001 are still on). You could tell he was passionate and willing to help strangers. I don't think he's an exploiter. I honestly think he probably just needs to go to business school or partner with an experience mentor to make himself a better entrepreneur. Hindsight 20/20, his crash & burn style of management and rush to empire building leaves casualties like Brad and his family and what's happening here.

[Mr.Delicious]

I am not going to tolerate CA.O being dragged through the mud when it had NOTHING to do with Brad Rigney or anyone elses royalty issue that may have occurred. The thread title will stay as it is. That is it. And if Brad Rigney wants to drag CA.O or if anyone else wants to drag CA.O through the mud and commit libel or slander or defamation or business interference then that is their own issue and they will deal with it. No one stole anything. TAD was late to pay. Rigney was paid tens of thousands of dollars for his video over the years and his last payment has been made by John English at TAD. If it was sony or EA or Microsoft (all of whom have been late to pay with me for example, and we had that up there, we would be getting letters from their lawyers. Both CA.O and I could have very easily done that with Brad and did not. I have worked to clear this up and have been all over TAD since last June and prior to be sure it's finance department does its job). I will not allow CA to be run through the mud on this again. I am working on the report and audit to prove that my statements are true and folks are going to have to realize that writing that someone stole something when they did not is called libel. Saying they did is called slander. Both can be defamation. All three are against the law. I will not allow CA.O or myself to be defamed any longer and I will not see anyone acting to make a bigger mess. If you have an issue with that I am sorry. I have simply had enough.


Jason

I know this is mean, but you just threatened to have a lawyer battle

[Pezz]

First of all I don't know Jason personally. I have seen his name first at sijun where he was sharing his art knowledge (his threads from 2001 are still on). You could tell he was passionate and willing to help strangers. I don't think he's an exploiter. I honestly think he probably just needs to go to business school or partner with an experience mentor to make himself a better entrepreneur. Hindsight 20/20, his crash & burn style of management and rush to empire building leaves casualties like Brad and his family and what's happening here.

Logged in after a while just like Sorknes just to say this:

If you really think that's how it is, then you haven't been here long enough to know better.

[paperX]

First of all I don't know Jason personally. I have seen his name first at sijun where he was sharing his art knowledge (his threads from 2001 are still on). You could tell he was passionate and willing to help strangers. I don't think he's an exploiter. I honestly think he probably just needs to go to business school or partner with an experience mentor to make himself a better entrepreneur. Hindsight 20/20, his crash & burn style of management and rush to empire building leaves casualties like Brad and his family and what's happening here.

People can change, sometimes not for the better.

[Deadlyhazard]

I doubt even .2% of the world even reads this forum actively, and especially shifting through tons of pages like this thread has. Employers might do a background check, but I doubt they'll do it through here unless you have links sprinkled everywhere from other sources. Even then...idk.

[Appylon]

Thanks, Sorknes. For new people like me scrolling through the whole thread and only ever getting hints and references to events in the past it is hard to make a judgment on earlier behavior and I appreciate someone taking the time to list it out. It definitely paints a vivid picture and I can finally begin understand where a lot of the posters are coming from. I remember seeing your posts a long time ago and I just didn't realize you had permanently left.

I will not insult anyone by trying to understand the why's of the past. I wasn't involved, and I don't deserve to have a say about it. I simply don't know enough about it even with your descriptions. I do hope that it is related to the events happening today and not just about seeking retribution for old misdeeds. An eye for an eye leaves the forum dry.

Yes, I do realize saying that what I am about to say makes me sound selfish... but:

What I do wish would stop happening is people bringing up the folks leaving (or at least the way they bring it up). Everyone referring to all these amazing, talented people abandoning ship is completely disheartening to me and I can only suspect other new artists as well. It is absolutely their prerogative to do what they feel is right, but the way people write about it makes me feel like Noah's ark and the rest of us are just drowning in the sewers and filth the superstars left behind. It's a damn shame those awesome people are gone. I regret not knowing them. But more people will come, wont they? Those people will get better, new stars will be forged and it can be a golden age again. Hell, just scrolling through the sketchbooks proves how many talented people are still here! It's an amazing thing.

That all being said, if injustice was intentionally done, and has been done many times over, I, and I assume everyone else here, will not support it.

[JFierce]

@PaperX

Thanks. That's definitely contradicting and a pretty big one I'm surprised I didn't see earlier in this thread way more. Now there's little I can debate. As that was clearly opposite, if Sterling is the guy to contact for the financials. Just will have to wait for new evidence to come forward.

[Velocity Kendall]

[paperX]

I'm just gonna add a few points to Sorknes' amazing post to make it round to a whole number:

Twenty-seventh: It wasn't just one workshop that was cancelled without warning...anyone remember CA workshop Shanghai? The numerous "business trips" for location scouting?

Twenty-eighth: Even after TAD started Jason promised artists like Graydon Parrish and Chris Appelhans, whom as far as I know never did happen.

Twenty-ninth: How the San Francisco Pod turned out back in the day, if it weren't for The S A F E H O U S E Atelier, those students back in the day would have been seriously screwed (they didn't call it S A F E H O U S E for nothing).

Thirtieth: I find it funny that Jason of all people would talk about defamation. I guess he forgot that time when he decided to publicly post the personal info of young kids for who pirated CA videos to make sure they 'never get a job in this industry in the future'. I guess it all seems a bit ironic now right?

@Velocity Kendall:

[Zenith_]

Yes, I do realize saying that what I am about to say makes me sound selfish... but:

What I do wish would stop happening is people bringing up the folks leaving (or at least the way they bring it up). Everyone referring to all these amazing, talented people abandoning ship is completely disheartening to me and I can only suspect other new artists as well. It is absolutely their prerogative to do what they feel is right, but the way people write about it makes me feel like Noah's ark and the rest of us are just drowning in the sewers and filth the superstars left behind. It's a damn shame those awesome people are gone. I regret not knowing them. But more people will come, wont they? Those people will get better, new stars will be forged and it can be a golden age again. Hell, just scrolling through the sketchbooks proves how many talented people are still here! It's an amazing thing.

It can be frustrating to hear of "days gone by" as a new user, but as someone who's been lurking since 2007, I have to say that the atmosphere of the entire forum has changed. Not necessarily meaning that it's a bad place to learn and grow as an artist, idk it's just different. I missed the whole debacle of 2009 though so I can't say for certain whether it happened before after or during that.
But that doesn't mean you still can't find great artists here, like you said, it's just that the numbers might a dwindled a bit.

[BigJoe14]

Twenty-ninth: How the San Francisco Pod turned out back in the day, if it weren't for The Atelier, those students back in the day would have been seriously screwed (they didn't call it for nothing).

I'm going off topic with this question, but are there any details on why the San Francisco Pod was shut down? I was always curious about this...

Edit: Didn't Ron and Vanessa Lemen also open up a San Diego Pod several months ago? What happened to that one?

[Enflamed Paper]

PaperX here.

Okay, I don't know what you did, but congrats Jason, you found a new way to solidify your draconian dictatorship over CA.

Thanks for adding S A F E H O U S E atelier to your growing forum censorship list.

Thanks for doing something to my account where I get nothing but "The server is too busy at the moment. Please try again later" and Database Error messages.

Thanks for blacklisting my IP or whatever it is that you did to restrict me from making a new account because "spammers are not tolerated".

If you think doing this will hide the truth, it's not going to work.

Edit: See below (left logged in as Enflamed Paper in Chrome, right logged in as PaperX)

[NeecHMonkeY]

EDIT: Question withdrawn.

[Nemome]

The post is still there NeecHMonkeY.
At lesat I can see it?

To PaperX, I don't know what's going on there and I don't have the permissions for the AdminPanel to look things up.
If it's true that your accout got "disabled" with that strange methode, then there will be another angry mob here soon.

I'll hope someone can explain that very soon.

PaperX - Please keep checking if you don't get access to your "old" account. If it works again, write it here please. Thanks.

[Arshes Nei]

The post is still there NeecHMonkeY.
At lesat I can see it?

To PaperX, I don't know what's going on there and I don't have the permissions for the AdminPanel to look things up.
If it's true that your accout got "disabled" with that strange methode, then there will be another angry mob here soon.

I'll hope someone can explain that very soon.

PaperX - Please keep checking if you don't get access to your "old" account. If it works again, write it here please. Thanks.

The post got moderated. It was probably not on purpose since they have to put mods in place to protect against spammers.

[Enflamed Paper]

I'd like to give you guys the benefit of doubt...but it's hard for me to not think whoever deleted it only backpedaled after 'they' realised someone actually saw it.

Anyways, still the same with my paperX account, everything works fine if I'm logged out, as soon as I login BAM, nothing loads and I get server is too busy error.

Plus S A F E H O U S E is obviously still censored...I guess Big Brother's back.

[Lyraina]

I think we should all just stop with the random accusations, slashing and biting in here, and give Jason the time to release his side of the story and provide the proof people want to see. We've listened to Brad, now we should calm down a bit and wait for Jasons official reply.
It's just getting worse for everybody otherwise.

[kliest]

as an illustrator of thirty years.. with some experience of agents accumulating your royalties and then saying they cannot pay you..

i am quite shocked that a similar problem has moved over to the digital art world..with the printed book illustation market in decline

it seems that illustration agents bad habits.. have found a new area to give grief to concept/illustration artists..

i know many artists that have been left high and dry..with no alternative but to go to the courts for redress claims..


best wishes to all..

[Velocity Kendall]

Censoring C G H U B etc is bizarre and silly.

[Arshes Nei]

I'd like to give you guys the benefit of doubt...but it's hard for me to not think whoever deleted it only backpedaled after 'they' realised someone actually saw it.

Anyways, still the same with my paperX account, everything works fine if I'm logged out, as soon as I login BAM, nothing loads and I get server is too busy error.

Plus S A F E H O U S E is obviously still censored...I guess Big Brother's back.

Just to explain the technical part of the matter. It probably happened because you edited your post. It was a frequent trick for spambots to post and get through the queue but then go back and edit it added pictures it probably set off the mod because the post count was low. It doesn't just affect you, but has happened to new users here frequently when they edit their sketchbook page. It's a bug that causes a headache amongst CA staff when it happens on the OP of a thread it's a pain to get it out of queue.

You'll see a post by Black Spot about users not editing the first part of their sketchbook thread.

[Enflamed Paper]

Thanks Arshes, that's fair enough.

My paperX account is still crippled though, come on Jason, you might as well ban me and put me out of my misery.

[Arshes Nei]

Thanks Arshes, that's fair enough.

My paperX account is still crippled enough, come on Jason, you might as well ban me and put me out of my misery.

You are quite welcome. If you have any more concerns you can message me in email or on IM since as I said I need to take a break. It's just I can't help myself when I see users having technical issues and I'm very familiar with vbull so I can at least clear up things for you guys. I guess that's what I get for being the resident nerd girl