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Thread: Hecatic's intensive weekly study group.

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    Hecatic's intensive weekly study group.

    Hello, most of us here are beginners and going to start a long journey here.
    Even if some of you are not in our group, you guys are very welcome to give critiques of our studies.

    Members:
    Aonegamer
    Hecatic
    Prototypt'
    Zol
    *I am looking for one more person to join us - feel free to PM me.


    Weekly Topic:
    Not Decided yet.

    So, we should choose a topic. I am thinking of human anatomy. We should pick some parts of the body, and practice drawing them. Maybe, we should study head to neck , legs to feet, shoulders to hands, and lastly, whole body.
    I expect to see at least 10 drawings of our topic.
    Let me know what you guys think.
    "The only time I feel alive is when I'm painting."
    ~Vincent Van Gogh

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    Charlie D is offline Registered User Level 5 Gladiator: Myrmillo
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    Learning to see

    "...the ideas are what matter most" Doug Chiang

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    Prototypt' is offline Registered User Level 3 Gladiator: Catervarii
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    Can we start this week finally??? Does anyone have a topic yet? If not, or noone answers I'll just think of a topic myself and beginn posting in here. finnianm is also with us btw.

    Seriously, where is everyone?? I would appreciate if you say something if you will be off for a week or so. At the moment I feel like everyone lost interrest..

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    I am too waiting to hear.
    we need to decide 2 important things:

    1. TOPIC to start drawing with.
    2. A common time where about we can all be together to get the bets outcome.

    and if live messenger is all ready we can start the chat as well.
    GMAIL is all ready all the time to have team chat.
    so please hurry up.

    Hoping to listen only above 2 things rather than anything else.

    Let me ease up the big thing.

    So let the first topic to draw be:

    A Spartan (all Spartans are 8 packs) who has drawn his sword out and is all ready to fight with his mouth open with anger saying "this is Sparta". (inspiration 300)


    Suggestions:
    Pay attention on his muscles. Tense muscles can reflect his anger. Pose can really multiply his aggression. Spartans are real man, show the heat of real man in his eyes.

    Do not copy the 300 but try and make the best what we can come out with.

    Spartans Are you ready? aaahooo aahoooo
    Last edited by Aonegamer; April 8th, 2012 at 02:06 PM.

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    Prototypt' is offline Registered User Level 3 Gladiator: Catervarii
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    I would suggest we present our work during the week, and talk about it on the weekend. I don't want to set up a gmail account. I allready have too much accounts on thousands of platforms.. Maybe we should get the blog running and the chat, later we could call each other. But we can also just start right now without the blog. So lets just get a topic and from tomorrow till next sunday we will draw and draw and post everything in here. After that we can talk about our work and maybe add some ideas on our blog/chat/critics/post system aswell.
    If noone decides a topic by tomorrow I'll post it and start working. But I never really did this before. Maybe I'd take "landscapes" or "anatomy" or faces. I also thought of more style related studying like "try achieving a painterly/realistic/... style". Or some idea studies like "draw sadness" or "draw nature mixed with the human being"..

    I know that last ones are very unconventionall but I think they are important too.
    So, again if you want me to decide I'll post the topic tomorrow, otherwise say what we gonna start with

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    Prototypt' is offline Registered User Level 3 Gladiator: Catervarii
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    Allright, there we go

    The topic is decided:

    Quote Originally Posted by Aonegamer
    So let the first topic to draw be:

    A Spartan (all Spartans are 8 packs) who has drawn his sword out and is all ready to fight with his mouth open with anger saying "this is Sparta". (inspiration 300)


    Suggestions:
    Pay attention on his muscles. Tense muscles can reflect his anger. Pose can really multiply his aggression. Spartans are real man, show the heat of real man in his eyes.

    Do not copy the 300 but try and make the best what we can come out with.

    Spartans Are you ready? aaahooo aahoooo
    As this is a very complex topic, try only to do about 2-4 sketches with different poses and amour, face, expressions and stuff. Work hard on each one and get it as detailed as you can afford.

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    Critics please:

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    Prototypt' is offline Registered User Level 3 Gladiator: Catervarii
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    Looks good, maybe you should make it more clearly he's actually screaming At the moment he could be breathing heavily or something too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Prototypt' View Post
    Here is my first try on this: I made it traditionally with a pencil and paper. It hasn't go a lot detail and the propotions are wrong at some places. Especially that very tiny hands, wtf..
    Wow good. your pic is really dynamic and is cenamatically a good composition.
    But anotomy is absent.
    you need to focus on anatomy, if you aim for realistic drawing.
    But even that depend upon individual style. I think that anatomy is not always important, for eg popeye the sailor man is all opposite to anatomy but still it is epic character. However anatomy will help.
    Last edited by Aonegamer; April 11th, 2012 at 11:17 PM.

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    Check this:


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    Prototypt' is offline Registered User Level 3 Gladiator: Catervarii
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    Your anatomy is great to compare ^^
    I really like that helmet design!!! Maybe he could use some more clothes, maybe a cape or sth Would make him more dramatic. Also this one misses the strength in his shout a bit. You could make him bow a bit so it looks like he tries to shout as loud as possible.

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    OK. so here is one more shot.
    I made it before your above comments, so again their is no variation in the cloths.

    Meanwhile, we should arrange for a IM along with this.
    As hectic is absent so for time being we can arrange it to some external IM like google, hotmail,yahoo.... whichver you have I will try and create my in that particular thing if its free.

    Others, I guess have gone to their pavilions.

    So, Prototypt' how can we make the best outta our studies, any suggestions ?

    1.what time zone you lives in and between what times you are available in ?
    2. any suggestion for IM or other technique ?
    3. any suggestion for the below art ?
    4. what should be our next topic ?


    Last edited by Aonegamer; April 12th, 2012 at 05:35 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Prototypt' View Post
    Nice ^^ I like how the head's flying away and he's like "aww mah gawd" (or would it be allah in this case?)

    Nice emotions and movement in the picture. I just got the feeling that the spartans legs are a bit big. And they seem to connect a bit too much at the bottom, uhm - i hope you know what I mean.

    for messaging, do you use skype? I could send you my skype name via pm if that's ok. I live in germany, so timezone is "GTM +1h". During the week I only have time in the afternoon (from 5 o'clock i should be there mostly) during the weekends my pc is running most of the time, what doesnt mean I am actually using it It's more random. If I want to do sth with friends, walk my dog, or sometimes I just don't feel like working or playing with the computer..
    Ok I am now on skype, so plz send me you skype name.
    for time, I guess we can have common slot between 5:30 to 8:30 (GMT +1h).

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    Did you PM the rest? I figure there's no point in me doing it now if you already did. Either way, a three man army will work too!

    Since I'm completely clueless to drawing from imagination, I'd love for something that isn't overly complex like the human figure, or at least where there's room for some more simplistic stuff (or we can just do something straight-forward like anatomy or perspective studies). I'm open to anything though.

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    Prototypt' is offline Registered User Level 3 Gladiator: Catervarii
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    I sent a pm to morningtea, the others will show up or they wont. But I forgot telling finnianm, so I will pm him now. Tomorrow someone has to decide the new topic, otherwise I will think of one

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    I'm here now

    And just like what I suggested to Prototypt' in the pm, I think we should start from the very basic shapes rendering then upgrade to human anatomy.Boring?maybe.Worth it? Definitely.
    But it's your choice.

    Edit: forgot to say, I don't have a Skype.Sorry
    Last edited by Morningtea; April 15th, 2012 at 11:55 PM.

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    Rendering basic shapes sounds great, I'm game! This will probably help. We could do some from reference, then some from imagination?

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    Yeah, that would be great.
    If it's decided..so, when do we start?

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    Prototypt' is offline Registered User Level 3 Gladiator: Catervarii
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    We do studies from monday until friday/saturday. On the weekend we could discuss the pictures. I found something usefull on the net:

    Subjects to study

    Study everything! You need to build a large library of shapes and things in your head to be able to draw intuitively. This takes about a lifetime or more to do, so you better start now!

    Human anatomy - One of the most important things you need to know. Even monsters have traces of human anatomy.

    The whole body. Use photos, anatomy books, statues or real people.
    The face is the thing we look at first. If you misplace a line just a bit the whole expression of the face will change. Make studies of photos, your friends or yourself.
    The hands are also important (and hard) to learn.
    The feet can be tricky too, not because of the shapes, but because you need to plant the character on the ground so it doesn't look like it's falling over or the ground is leaning.
    Daily clothing. It's important to learn how cloth wrinkles, how different types of cloth looks and fits.

    Gestures & styles - You need to be diverse and get fresh ideas. Learning some different styles can be a good idea.

    Draw from life using your friends or people at a cafe, a bus or somewhere. How does a person pose when he opens a door, reaches for his keys, and looks intimidated by an artist?
    Marvel. How does the Marvel artists represent the human body with lines? What details are important and what is simplified?
    Modesty Blaise, or some fairly realistic comic style. Drawing gradients with just blacks and whites isn't easy.
    Manga or a style you like. Again, how does the artist convert the human anatomy into lines and color blobs? What parallels can you draw between the different styles?

    Environments - Putting your character in an environment really brings it alive. This is something I definitely need to learn myself.

    Landscapes with fields, mountains or whatever.
    A dense forest or a jungle.
    An urban or industrial 'landscape'.
    An indoor setting, like a room with furniture. Boring, I know. To be honest I haven't done this yet.

    Fetch an animal book - ...and draw some animals. A good way to design a monster is to morph different animals into one.

    All living things. Mother nature have spent millions of years perfecting the designs, so you better study them.
    Horses, Cats, Dogs, birds. These are especially important since they are more commonly seen.

    Machinery - You also need to practice drawing machinery. It can be useful when designing robots and planet-smashing vengeance-crazed battle droids.

    Cars of different models.
    Digging and working machinery.
    Military vehicles.

    Classical still life objects - Or basically anything. Good for learning how to draw and paint in general, because of the simple shapes. You won't have too struggle much the shapes and can concentrate more on the materials.

    Flowers, fruit, skeletons, sculpts, chunks of wood, rusty metal parts.

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    Here's my first go, got some more shapes to finish from the reference before moving on to drawing without ref! The cone looks off by quite a bit to me, both the perspective and the actual rendering. I drew strictly from reference, so I didn't actually check the perspective. Wasn't really sure how to go about it, I'll try with some guidelines for the next one. Shadow of the cube looks wrong too, those were the biggest mistakes I noticed.


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    Great start
    I'm currently trying my best T^T
    Is it stupid to shade a whole drawing with HB pencil?Cause' there isn't much contrast
    Hmmm I'll try using my 2B pencil this time X'D

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    And here's mine!~
    Did a sketch for the cylinder to get it right.
    And yochanan, there's a method to know where the shadows fall.
    Here's a picture I found.
    And another pic here.
    It needs an explanation a bit^^"
    I'll try to make it clearer later with the studies~

    I think we should vary the light source angles ,distance,quantity and colors.
    But that would be a bit advanced~so we'll do it later on maybe.
    Attached Images Attached Images  

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    That's not stupid at all, actually I never used anything higher than HB and 2H for my bargues. The value of the pencil isn't important, all that matters is the relationships of values within the drawing.

    It's a bit hard to wrap your head around it at first, but all that really matters for making it "work" and not have it look flat is the contrast (or relationship) between the values you use, not their local darkness or brightness.



    Maybe this can help demonstrate it? Even though some detail is lost (since it becomes darker or brighter), the form and transitions are still the same and because the relationship between the darkest and brightest values don't change, it still reads as the same form. I don't know if that makes sense or not, I probably didn't explain it that well. Anyways, you can definitely do these with an HB pencil and make them work, 2B pencils tend to be a bit more smudgy as well!

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    Ah yep, I know the method to make the shadow fall properly, but I didn't bother with the perspective grid this time around. I just tried getting it right off the reference for a start. You did a great job anyways, the highlights on the right sphere look a bit blown out and maybe too much reflected light on the left one, but that's really all I could tell!

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    Prototypt', I think it would help a lot if you check the shape of the object and the shadow areas first before adding in a lot of strokes for the rendering. A big blob of your darkest value to get the contours of an object before adding in the lights might help! It would make it easier to fix any proportion issues earlier on as well.

    There seems to be some confusion going on with the values of the pipe, one stroke is light, one is dark, then the next is lighter again etc., making it hard to read right. Try to simplify the values more, just do the darkest area and make sure the value is there (and the same for the lightest area) before moving on to the transition. Good try though, keep updating throughout the week and we'll all improve a ton I'm sure!

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    finnianm is offline Registered User Level 1 Gladiator: Andabatae
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    Hey guys, sorry for being absent the past few weeks
    I would love to participate! I will start some geometry tonight!

    Over the past couple days I've been working on a waterfall landscape, though my perspective is really wrong in some parts, I want to continue...
    The right is supposed to be a rock haha, I need to fix it! :/
    If anyone has tips working with rocks/water, would appreciate it!


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    Prototypt' is offline Registered User Level 3 Gladiator: Catervarii
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    nice, finally you are back too

    at the moment we do shape and geometry like said above. I am not good with landscapes and rocks myself, so I couldnt do sth like this myself any better ^^
    yes the perspective is odd i would recommend to fix the perspective now, before its too late and you did all the lightning and stuff

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    Prototypt': I'm guessing you mean that the transitions are too similar in values? I definitely agree with you there, it's hard to tell there's even anything going on. I'll blame part of it on the reference, but hey it's not like I couldn't have just bumped up the contrast on that, and either way I probably should've gone darker in relation to the shadow.

    finnianm: Awesome to have you with us man, here I was thinking we'd end up being two or three people! I doubt any of us can help you with perspective, but I did remember reading a short section on waterfalls in Alla Prima and figured I could just scan it. Hopefully Richard Schmid won't mind, considering how many people I recommend this book to (it's awesome, buy it)! It's not much, but it's just about all I got haha. I think looking at how he painted it will be useful, since he catches it so well without a ridiculous amount of detail. I'm guessing you don't have a waterfall near you to study. Maybe a video on YouTube?



    Here's mine for today! Didn't really like the cylinder. I'll probably finish the last shapes off this reference chart tomorrow though. The shadows didn't seem all that clear on it, so next time I'll try to draw from imagination or maybe find some better reference.

    Last edited by yochanan; April 17th, 2012 at 06:42 PM.

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    Wow, thanks so much man, I really appreciate it! When I next work on the painting, ill set up some of those youtube videos so I have a better ref. (the music in Havasupai is really relaxing too *_* )

    Here are my geometry sketches for today, I'm going to see if I can work on anatomy a bit too since thats my weakest topic


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