I want to improve...

[vineris]

(I saw I need to wait until a Moderator accepts my new message, that can't be good).

Oh, no, that doesn't mean anything. It's part of the anti-spam system. New user posts, especially ones with links or images, are sometimes automatically put into the moderation queue so that a moderator can look at them and make sure they are not spam. After you have made a certain number of posts, about 20 or more, this will no longer happen. Also, don't edit your posts until you are no longer a new user -- the anti-spam system has a bug and sometimes we can't approve the edited post.

[Zilkenian]

Oh, no, that doesn't mean anything. It's part of the anti-spam system. New user posts, especially ones with links or images, are sometimes automatically put into the moderation queue so that a moderator can look at them and make sure they are not spam. After you have made a certain number of posts, about 20 or more, this will no longer happen. Also, don't edit your posts until you are no longer a new user -- the anti-spam system has a bug and sometimes we can't approve the edited post.

Oh, I see. Then I won't do it again. Thanks for giving me the advice and explaining me this.
By the way, I think I'll make a new sketchbook once I have more drawings because the one I did, 73 people ignored it XDDD.

[element1988]

No need to start another, just add to the one you have. Some people only look at sketchbooks with 4+ pages so making a new one wont help you.

[Psychotime]

Lot of people told me I should stop doing that and find my style, that's why I wanted to find it.

Do any of those people actually draw well, let alone draw at all?

So...the way I was doing is alright? AMAZING!!! One thing I do well, one hundred to go...XD

I didn't say that, now...

I don't want to "draw so beautiful like the others", I want to draw "beautiful like I want", but I still have those manga references stuck in my mind. That's what makes me angry.

And that's were studying from reality comes in. You need to know the real in order to cartoon it. Every good cartoonist knows that.

Sorry, but, you know, manga is so beautiful and all, but is like a trap: you have to follow so many rules you get tired of them, and all of sudden you find yourself trying to escape from them. Could happen the same with Marvel, DC or any style known in the whole world, not just manga.

And by the way, this irks the hell out of me every time I hear it. The people who say stuff like this have no idea what they're talking about.

Look at manga artists like Akira Toriyama, Osamu Tezuka, Naoko Takeuchi, and Yoshito Usui. Tell me what they all have in common.

Look at Marvel artists like Skottie Young and John Romita Jr. Tell me what they have in common.

Look at DC artists like Dustin Nguyen and Brian Bolland. Tell me what they have in common.

[Kiera]

You can sit and complain that it is hard to get a job, or you can go seek a job.

Careful for bootstrapin'
http://epp.eurostat.ec.europa.eu/sta...20120502094632
(source is the statistical office of the European Union)
The jobless youth quote is around 50%.
Half of the youth. Spain is a pretty crazy place right now.



Otherwise I don't have a lot more to say.
Zilkenian, more detail does not make a style better.

If you want some education, widen your influences and look at complete works of art.
Complete books about art, movies, comics or biographies,
not just superficial and meaningless tidbits of fanculture found on Tumblr, Deviantart or any other website.

If you want technical improvement, here's John K's curriculum: http://johnkcurriculum.blogspot.de/
and Preston Blair's Advanced Animation book: http://animationresources.org/?p=2091

[vineris]

Sorry, but, you know, manga is so beautiful and all, but is like a trap: you have to follow so many rules you get tired of them, and all of sudden you find yourself trying to escape from them. Could happen the same with Marvel, DC or any style known in the whole world, not just manga.
I don't want to "draw so beautiful like the others", I want to draw "beautiful like I want", but I still have those manga references stuck in my mind. That's what makes me angry.

No it's not. It's just a habit. I started out by copying western cartoon styles, then switched to manga, then I got tired of manga and switched to something else. All these different ways of drawing things are still in my head. It took some time to switch from one habit to another, but I just kept changing things and eventually the changes accumulated together and my style looked different.

You are not trapped. If you can draw a circle you can also draw a square. If you can draw big eyes you can draw small eyes. If you can draw cute proportions, you can draw non-cute proportions. But you have to think about what you are doing. When you don't think, habit rules you. When you do think about what you are doing, and how it looks, and how it compares to the work of artists you would like to draw like, then you can change habits. When people are "trapped" by a style it is usually because of two things -- one is a lack of thinking, the other is a fear of trying something completely new and making bad-looking art.

[Zilkenian]

Do any of those people actually draw well, let alone draw at all?

.........

And by the way, this irks the hell out of me every time I hear it. The people who say stuff like this have no idea what they're talking about.

Look at manga artists like Akira Toriyama, Osamu Tezuka, Naoko Takeuchi, and Yoshito Usui. Tell me what they all have in common.

Look at Marvel artists like Skottie Young and John Romita Jr. Tell me what they have in common.

Look at DC artists like Dustin Nguyen and Brian Bolland. Tell me what they have in common.

Ok, yes, I made an error here. I meant those new mangas that come out now, they are like they want to like, and not to be originals. I have a great respect for Osamu Tezuka, and other manga artists, and Marvel and DC. I do have my idols in there. I have idols everywhere, so sorry if I said it in a wrong way or didn't make myself clear.

The jobless youth quote is around 50%.
Half of the youth. Spain is a pretty crazy place right now.

Reading it from you makes me cry. Thanks for saying this to him, because we are really suffering. But this is not the place to discuss political things, or economy. It's a place where art must take over everything else.

Complete books about art, movies, comics or biographies,
not just superficial and meaningless tidbits of fanculture found on Tumblr, Deviantart or any other website.

If you want technical improvement, here's John K's curriculum: http://johnkcurriculum.blogspot.de/
and Preston Blair's Advanced Animation book: http://animationresources.org/?p=2091

That's what I do. I don't go into Tumblr to look for drawings. That place is crazy. I only go in there when I need a moment to laugh a bit, nothing else.
I do look for entire book, concept art of comic and movies (specially animation movies), storyboard, artbooks, etc.

Thank you for the links.

Hehe, have to admit, vineris, you gave me a lesson here. I deserved it for what I said. But it's...I think is more a personal thing than the style itself. I don't know when I started to hate it that much, when I used to love it before. Can't tell why.
But recently I've been reading Astro Boy (Atom), and I fell in love with the style.
I think I want to see everyone's style, and not a bunch of them...don't know.

I think I thanked all of you. This is really helping me .

I want a Light table....I'm quite good in traditional animation, but I fail with traditional animation.....I want one :'D.

[The Fez]

Is this one of those "I draw anime and self-consciously post it on forums where I implicitly understand that foundational skills are constantly brought up by everyone all the time" threads? I think it might be. It has all the right conversation.

The best way to stop drawing anime is to stop drawing anime. Boom. Done. If your characters wear F-cups, have blue hair, and feature dinner plates for eyes, you are drawing anime. If you do not draw that, you will not be drawing anime. If your anime character whines like a silly bitch about having to pilot a twenty story tall biotic mecha in order to kill aliens, then you are Hideaki Anno, which is totally unrelated.

[Zilkenian]

Is this one of those "I draw anime and self-consciously post it on forums where I implicitly understand that foundational skills are constantly brought up by everyone all the time" threads? I think it might be. It has all the right conversation.

The best way to stop drawing anime is to stop drawing anime. Boom. Done. If your characters wear F-cups, have blue hair, and feature dinner plates for eyes, you are drawing anime. If you do not draw that, you will not be drawing anime. If your anime character whines like a silly bitch about having to pilot a twenty story tall biotic mecha in order to kill aliens, then you are Hideaki Anno, which is totally unrelated.

WTF? XDDDD

This is a "I draw like anime and I hate myself for it, and I want to go back to basics so I can do a better thing....no, a thing I like better than anime" thread. You like it? It took me 2-3 days to make it work.

Actually, I stopped drawing characters with pink, blue, blinding red, blinding orange, purple, black with purple, black with blue, black with blinding orange....you get the point, hair.
And I don't draw characters in "OMG THAT'S A HUGE ROBOT BUT I'LL CALL IT MECHA BECAUSE IT SOUNDS SO EPIC I CAN'T STAND IT!!". I'm trying to not make those ridiculously big eyes, and trying to go back to a face that looks human, and not an alien with human features.

That's why I'm drawing normal human poses and not "Eugh I'm breaking my spine" poses that you can see in almost every manga/anime drawing.

Sorry, you triggered this side of me....
Oh, and I'm trying to get a cartoon-realistic style. I already have a cartoon-cartoon style.

[Slothboy3000]

I'm not gonna read any of the other comments. I'll just say you need to learn from observational drawing more. And however many times that's been said, it's probably proving a point that here's another to add to the list.

[Zilkenian]

I'm not gonna read any of the other comments. I'll just say you need to learn from observational drawing more. And however many times that's been said, it's probably proving a point that here's another to add to the list.

What list? And yes, they already told me that and it's what I'm doing in my sketchbook. Thanks anyway, your comment is appreciated .

[cfhd]

What list? And yes, they already told me that and it's what I'm doing in my sketchbook. Thanks anyway, your comment is appreciated .

Dude, you're in like some sort of anime denial or something. Everything you draw, even the 2-3 gestures in your sketchbook, look anime-ie. Your avatar is an anime head, the three drawings at the beginning of this thread are anime. Yet you keep saying how much you hate it and don't want to draw it.

Also, I thought you said you were an adult? Some of the things you have said in here sound extremely childish.

On top of this you said you don't have a job, yet you haven't shown much art work and keep coming up with excuses as to why you haven't posted any. If you don't have a job then you should have shitloads of time to practice your artwork. You should be able to nip this anime problems of yours in the butt in a day. Just stop drawing anime and start drawing from real life and doing studies. If you want to have a more western style of cartoons then look at the old Disney classics. They're amazing.

[The Fez]

Dude, you're in like some sort of anime denial or something.

Anime denial. Don't let it happen to you.

[LaCan]

Anime denial. Don't let it happen to you.

What is this 'anime' you speak of?

[Digitalwolf]

I don't think its completely fair to call her work anime. If her work is anime so is Avatar (the cartoon).

Its kind of offensive and is not going to help her improve anyway.

That said, i agree with the life drawing studies. It can be a lot more fun than it sounds and you'll learn a lot of new things pretty quickly.

[Dumb Naked King]

Not sure if anyone is going to agree with me on this, but I really don't think your problem has anything to do with anime influence. Anime art can be amazing if you embrace it and take what you like from it and leave what you don't, rather that think of it as a set of rules you have to follow.

The problem is, when I look at your art I don't think anime, I think b-rated nickelodeon show that only lasts for one season. It's not the anime influence that disturbs me, it's the plain lack of basic knowledge. You've made a mistake by jumping straight into cartooning (of ANY sort, not just anime), which is a lot more difficult than you seem to think it is.

If I were you I'd drop photoshop for a while, just stick to pen and paper. You're heading in the right direction in your sketchbook, just continue that and follow the lovely advice people already gave you.
And stop blowing up when people point out that it looks like this or that; you can't just shield yourself by going "don't say it looks like X because that makes me angry". You can't count on always being able to add an explanation to what you've drawn, it needs to be able to speak for itself.

[Zilkenian]

cfhd, as I said in my sketchbook, I may not have a job, but I still have a family who usually needs my help, and also, I go out to look for a job everyday. I'm not trying to excuse myself, I'm trying to say I'm not all the day in my house doing nothing. I have a life.
But, as I see, you'll just say again the same, so I give up with this part.
Second, yeah, I was childish, I know it, and I said sorry in one post, but since you don't read anything, you just blow it into my face. well, that's not so adult as I can see.

And now, lets just forget all this and start again from zero because I don't want to have a bad time here, I'm trying to change my drawing and swallow a bit my pride taking every criticism you give to me.

Oh, and yes, I've been watching Disney classics. For me, they are one of the tops of art. I think modern animation will never beat this traditional one. It's just wonderful.

Lets just take the 'anime denial' out of here, alright? You ate the second or third one to say this to me and I'm not stupid, I'm smarter than you think but for some reasons my childish side screws everything up.

I won't shield again, I promise. Also, I don't use Photoshop (only to scan things). I use Paint Tool Sai, but that's not the point here. I've been drawing only with pencil since I came here for the first time, but I take the advice anyway, thank you.

[arenhaus]

Enough excuses. Blame the economy, blame the family, blame anime, blame your own "childish side" whatever that is, blame blame blame blame.

Go draw.

[J.R.Hollis]

Ok, I don't think this forum needs another 14 page thread.

Everyone, LIKE I SAID is telling you the same thing. Draw realistically, we don't care if you do that already. Our advice is keep doing it forever. I won't use some sort of artsy fartsy words with you, draw real people.

Use these things or something, grab a pencil, keep going, until you die:
http://artists.pixelovely.com/practi...igure-drawing/
http://lovecastle.org/draw/

That is it, that is lesson number one here. We tell EVERYONE this.

We aren't mad at you, half of the people here are grown adults with kids and mini-vans and jobs. They don't care. Just forget this particular thread exists. And Draw, because in the end we really can't stop you.