Dile's paintover thread

[Dile_]

Hey guys!

Been wanting to do this for a really long time but things have gotten in the way and life's been busy! (it is now as well..just gotten things more under control..hehe)

Inspired by andrew sonea's attempt at keeping a thread like this one alive, I'm bringing you my own paint-over thread!

My name is Dennis and I'm a 20 year illustrator, matte-painter, conceptartist, you name it. I have somewhere between 3-4 years of experience in the freelance field and I've been painting for almost 7 years now! (started my first sb on this site in mars 2006!) time flies! damn.

Anyways, my work can be found here for the time being

http://fruktsallad.deviantart.com (which you are ofc welcomed to "watch"/follow etc, )

some works from ^











I'll also announce when I'll be doing the overpaints on my stream for any people who are interested in hearing more indepth about the process/my thoughts on the subject etc etc..

So feel free to post your works in here people!

-D

[Pavel Sokov]

Oh wow, great works, I am very excited.

You will get tired of me very fast I reckon.

Let me start.

A commissioned dog portrait:

[Venger]

@Pavel: Why this piece - you've already posted that the client is happy with it and refused changes. You've had multiple paintovers for this already. Pick something else will ya!

[Frida Bergholtz]

Oh I got a feeling that you are going to be bombarded with requests quite soon. Do you have any particular preference on what sort of pictures that you think would be fun to make paintovers of?

[kikindaface]

great dude !! looking forward to see some paintovers and learn from them !! good luck !!

[Pavel Sokov]

@Pavel: Why this piece - you've already posted that the client is happy with it and refused changes. You've had multiple paintovers for this already. Pick something else will ya!

Ok no problem. I will post an update to my Troll drinking beer painting when I get home from work.

[Syle]

Dile: Thanks for doing this! I've got this thread book marked so I will be checking back. Are you taking any requests for images to be painted over? I've got one image of a flying angel that I could really use some help on.

[Dile_]

Pavel: I think you got great advice in your thread, I think you should consider where YOU want to take the piece since you seem unhappy about where the client have pushed you towards. Not sure if it applies to the current image..but for your own illustrations in general. It seems as if you want people to add "your vision" to the piece which you've applied your client's vision to.

Syle: Not sure what you mean! The point of this thread is for you (everyone) to have a place to post your images where I (and anyone else, if they feel like it) can provide you with a paintover/critique. I'm also planning to, like I said in my first post, stream and have sessions where I go more indepth and to link it together a bit with my mentoring as well.

-D

[Velocity Kendall]

good man, this looks wicked!

[Leoz]

Awesome idea!

Would be epic if you checked this one out!



I want it to go more towards a realistic feel but I'm having trouble achieving that.
I also think that the composition isn't as interesting as i would want it to be

[EZpaint]

Looking forward to seeing what you bring with your paintovers, your work is sweet!

[DAMJAN]

You're stuff is awesome. Here are my pieces.

[Dile_]

Hi Leoz

I realize that this "paintover" won't match your vision, and shouldn't be looked at as a "potential next step" but rather will it deal with fundamentals and techniques related to issues with your painting.

Readability: I made the composition easier to read, everything is "pointing" towards a focal point. Even brushstrokes etc.

Depth: There is a lot of overlapping going on with light and shadow..this creates depth. Shapes are also overlapping over and over in a very basic way. Avoid tangents, they kill depth.

Story: I can't tell if yours is a "concept piece" or an illustration.. I went with a hybrid between the two really. I tried to keep most of the things that are important for the concept in yours while still focusing as much as possible on the elements that would help a "story". Path, looking over shoulder (makes you a part of the journey) and some sort of destination.

Color: Think of the properties of the lightsource and then the materials etc. If the lightsource is saturated, light areas will be saturated and and shadows will be desaturated, and vice versa. With "sand" which I turned your painting into, there is a lot of radiosity that will make it a bit warmer. Also consider making your focal point contrast the rest of your painting colorwise, just like you've done, but also take saturation into consideration. If everything is saturated, make the focal point desaturated and a different color etc.

I'll try to think of more things in the morning, getting very tired here.





Damjan: That looks very fun! I'll see what I can do to help you since you seem pretty advanced already.. Will definitely allow me to go more indepth..

[Syle]

Hey Dile, here is one I am working on. I took it as far as my knowledge could take me, which wasn't very far, haha.

I/we really can't thank you enough for doing this.

[Dile_]

Syle:

I'm definitely not more than OK at anatomy, but here is my go at it:

Less is more, simplify shapes and chunk big valuegroups together. It's gonna take you about 100 hours just to get those wings to a super high finish level.
Make sure all limbs are within the canvas and visible (if they should be) try to be sophisticated about it. If you gonna cut the canvas somewhere, make it an upperbody shot etc...

Light: show wherre the light is coming from, or at least indicate that light comes from somewhere (like i've done with the ground being red).

Proportions: Add a white layer and set it to 20% opacity, then draw in your figure in proportions with black (or any color), then turn the layer back to 100% opacity. If the anatomy works, it works, otherwise make the neccessary changes and get back to painting.

Shapes: I like that you're using brushstrokes to indicate the direction of the forms, it helps a lot. Just make sure that the shapes you're creating works and points the viewer around. Use triangles as shapes, even when you're painting something that isn't a triangle, such as a box etc, you can always put more emphasis on one edge creating an "arrow". It will work as a tool to "guide" the viewer around. Just experiment.
In general your painting is very flat, there is a background, although we can't tell on what "depth level" it is at, then there is the wings and then the body. The wings are the elements makes it the most flat at the moment, try to create some sort of motion..Are they moving? then indicate that etc.

Generally what I did was indicating that she is going somewhere, she is looking at something (although the face i painted is barely OK even for an example like this). If you're gonna go with the angle you have right now, look up ref. We should see more chin. I added a clear secondary light (the ground and the red bounce light) and clarified the primary light hitting her from above. I also tried to create more motion and adding in both the legs etc.
With your brushstrokes, think of all the possible directions they can go in. Try to stay away from leaving the just as shapes, "draw through" them and indicate that they have a form, even when they are very silhouetted.
Overall i tried to simplify the value groups, making it easier for me to use dark and light areas for overlapping etc. That creates more depth! : ] In retrospect, I think your top down lightning is working, and feels like we're looking up at her, which makes her a bit majestic, and I think it's something you should keep for sure! : ]

[Syle]

Dile, thank you so much for taking the time to do! How long did it take you to do this paintover? If you don't mind, I am going to ask a series of follow up questions just so I can further understand some of the choices you made.

Light: show wherre the light is coming from, or at least indicate that light comes from somewhere (like i've done with the ground being red).

That creates such a great effect. I love it. What made you choose the color red among any other? Also, the slanting of the ground in the bottom right gives such a great sense of action; so simple, yet so effective. It also helped added some grounding (no pun intended) to the character; she actually feels rooted to something with substance and depth.

Proportions: Add a white layer and set it to 20% opacity, then draw in your figure in proportions with black (or any color), then turn the layer back to 100% opacity. If the anatomy works, it works, otherwise make the neccessary changes and get back to painting.

That's a good idea/method. I'll be trying that.

I noticed you changed a few things about her body type (flatter stomach, smaller breasts, shorter neck). Were those conscious decisions to correct my mistakes? If so, what specifically was wrong with mine? Of all the things that are wrong in my original, the proportions of her body seem okay to my eyes; I used a fair bit of reference for her body. I should also note that nothing about your angel's body looks wrong either.

Shapes: I like that you're using brushstrokes to indicate the direction of the forms, it helps a lot. Just make sure that the shapes you're creating works and points the viewer around. Use triangles as shapes, even when you're painting something that isn't a triangle, such as a box etc, you can always put more emphasis on one edge creating an "arrow". It will work as a tool to "guide" the viewer around. Just experiment.
In general your painting is very flat, there is a background, although we can't tell on what "depth level" it is at, then there is the wings and then the body. The wings are the elements makes it the most flat at the moment, try to create some sort of motion..Are they moving? then indicate that etc.

That all makes pretty good sense. Especially your comments on it looking flat. Can you elaborate a bit on what you mean by using triangles as shapes to create a guide? I didn't quite understand that part. Perhaps there is an element in your paint over that could make that clear?

Generally what I did was indicating that she is going somewhere, she is looking at something (although the face i painted is barely OK even for an example like this). If you're gonna go with the angle you have right now, look up ref. We should see more chin. I added a clear secondary light (the ground and the red bounce light) and clarified the primary light hitting her from above. I also tried to create more motion and adding in both the legs etc.
With your brushstrokes, think of all the possible directions they can go in. Try to stay away from leaving the just as shapes, "draw through" them and indicate that they have a form, even when they are very silhouetted.

Good call on the chin. I never even noticed that until you mentioned it. Also, that secondary/red light is a killer effect! It's clear how effective a secondary light can be in creating depth on an object.

I did in fact add the second leg in, but I am not surprised you didn't see it considering how dark I made it. That secondary light you added is the game-changer for sure.

In retrospect, I think your top down lightning is working, and feels like we're looking up at her, which makes her a bit majestic, and I think it's something you should keep for sure!

Thanks Dile, that means a lot to me in this particular instance. Because, when I was first imagining, conceptualizing, and then sketching this image, those were the main two elements that I was really set to work into the design. I definitely wanted an upward perspective, and I definitely wanted some hard lighting from above to create those harsher cast shadows down the body's form. So, it's nice to know that at least in some small way, those two goals of mine actually came to be (in a limited sort of way ).

Thanks again man, I learned a lot with this paintover. I'll come back in a couple weeks with your critique worked into my original, and perhaps a new concept for you tear apart again


PS: How do you pronounce your screen name btw?

[Frida Bergholtz]

Hello Dile.

Very nice work so far.

Even though I feel like I should figure out my own issues I could not pass on the opportunity to se if I could get some additional insight on the painting that I'm working on right now. It might not look like much but I am way out of my comfort zone with this piece.

I'm also adding the lighting and value sketch to explain what I am aiming for.
Thank you in advance for any consideration.

[Pavel Sokov]

Ok so here is my work in progress.
It is a jolly Troll who has recently come into some money (with questionable legitimacy) and immediately proceeded to cover himself with jewelry and drink himself half to death. His owl is not impressed.

[Dile_]

That creates such a great effect. I love it. What made you choose the color red among any other? Also, the slanting of the ground in the bottom right gives such a great sense of action; so simple, yet so effective. It also helped added some grounding (no pun intended) to the character; she actually feels rooted to something with substance and depth.

I choosed red mostly because you had used some warm in your bounce-light areas, any color will do..experiment and try out different ones to get the feeling/mood you want! Do it early on and you won't have to second guess yourself so much later when/if changing stuff around.. ALso because you had red and cyan/green in your painting, I thought that would create a good complimentary effect when using the combination of greens/reds and gray/white

I noticed you changed a few things about her body type (flatter stomach, smaller breasts, shorter neck). Were those conscious decisions to correct my mistakes? If so, what specifically was wrong with mine? Of all the things that are wrong in my original, the proportions of her body seem okay to my eyes; I used a fair bit of reference for her body. I should also note that nothing about your angel's body looks wrong either.

Like I mentioned I'm not more than OK at anatomy, so I went with what I know at least a bit haha. I think the biggest problem with the anatomy in your image is the shoulders ( very wide..manly,not good for a female character etc) and the stomach which makes her look almost pregnant in that light. When I had "corrected them" I also balanced out a couple of other things..like the breast, because I felt they were a bit "too much" when the character is all naked.

That all makes pretty good sense. Especially your comments on it looking flat. Can you elaborate a bit on what you mean by using triangles as shapes to create a guide? I didn't quite understand that part. Perhaps there is an element in your paint over that could make that clear?

In my mind there are two kinds of illustrators, those who know design/shapes and those who don't. Look up people like Peleng, Jamie Jones, Thom (thomlab.com), Khang Le, John J Park (jparked.blogspot.com), Feng Zhu etc etc, some fantastic entertainment designers & illustrators who knows how to use shapes and edges to create a dynamic painting. Also if you can, get your hands on any books that shows the pre-production of disney films.. god damn (The art of tangled is a great one!) Everything is just design and shapes. And they use so little to create so much!

I did in fact add the second leg in, but I am not surprised you didn't see it considering how dark I made it. That secondary light you added is the game-changer for sure.

I can see it, and I painted "over it" because I didn't feel that it was helping or doing anything for the painting at all. I showed your painting to a couple of "non-artists" (well my gf and her family) and that is what they thought was the biggest problem. Like I said in my crit, you want to show the whole body, or make sophisticated decisions when you crop something out of the canvas...

Thanks Dile, that means a lot to me in this particular instance. Because, when I was first imagining, conceptualizing, and then sketching this image, those were the main two elements that I was really set to work into the design. I definitely wanted an upward perspective, and I definitely wanted some hard lighting from above to create those harsher cast shadows down the body's form. So, it's nice to know that at least in some small way, those two goals of mine actually came to be (in a limited sort of way ).

Nice man! When I do mentoring, this "way" of creating images is one of the most important things I try to get out there: Meaning that you always always always should have an objective in your mind when you start out..That way..no matter how good or bad the painting turned out, you at least put some extra attention to that one objective, and even if the painting is a "fail", you got something out of it! Great to hear!

PS: How do you pronounce your screen name btw?

Haha, hmm, I made the screen name when I was 13.. (oh god why) and at the time I wanted to register Dyle but it was taken... ( after Dylan Cole, he was the main inspiration at the time..still is to a large degree! ) So it should sound something like Dyle or Dial ^^

[Kiera]

This thread is completely amazing, never seen something like this on CA .

Can I have a paintover or at a tip?
I have the feeling that I am constantly hitting a wall when it comes to landscapes.
Right now I'm trying to focus on shape, light and appealing color.
But I have the feeling that there's a lack of... something that I can't quite put my finger on.

Both are studies.
Attachment 1689660
Reference: http://www.flickr.com/photos/philipp...faves-kierach/

Attachment 1707527
Reference: http://fav.me/d36ah9g

[Syle]

[QUOTE]

I choosed red mostly because you had used some warm in your bounce-light areas, any color will do..experiment and try out different ones to get the feeling/mood you want! Do it early on and you won't have to second guess yourself so much later when/if changing stuff around.. ALso because you had red and cyan/green in your painting, I thought that would create a good complimentary effect when using the combination of greens/reds and gray/white

Right on. That's kind of what I thought, but I didn't want to guess at your reasoning.

Like I mentioned I'm not more than OK at anatomy, so I went with what I know at least a bit haha. I think the biggest problem with the anatomy in your image is the shoulders ( very wide..manly,not good for a female character etc) and the stomach which makes her look almost pregnant in that light. When I had "corrected them" I also balanced out a couple of other things..like the breast, because I felt they were a bit "too much" when the character is all naked.

That all makes sense. Thanks for clarifying.

In my mind there are two kinds of illustrators, those who know design/shapes and those who don't. Look up people like Peleng, Jamie Jones, Thom (thomlab.com), Khang Le, John J Park (jparked.blogspot.com), Feng Zhu etc etc, some fantastic entertainment designers & illustrators who knows how to use shapes and edges to create a dynamic painting. Also if you can, get your hands on any books that shows the pre-production of disney films.. god damn (The art of tangled is a great one!) Everything is just design and shapes. And they use so little to create so much!

I love Peleng and Feng Zhu. I'll check out those other artists as well.

I can see it, and I painted "over it" because I didn't feel that it was helping or doing anything for the painting at all. I showed your painting to a couple of "non-artists" (well my gf and her family) and that is what they thought was the biggest problem. Like I said in my crit, you want to show the whole body, or make sophisticated decisions when you crop something out of the canvas...

Cool, thanks for clarifying your approach.

Haha, hmm, I made the screen name when I was 13.. (oh god why) and at the time I wanted to register Dyle but it was taken... ( after Dylan Cole, he was the main inspiration at the time..still is to a large degree! ) So it should sound something like Dyle or Dial ^^

Right on

I'll wait a couple of weeks before submitting another painting. Thanks again Dile!

[Leoz]

Dude, thanks alot! - You've reached the highest peak on the awesomeness scale.
Your paintover was truly helpful

[Dile_]

I'm getting back to this thread in a couple of days, in the meantime, post your work for critique/paintovers to come!

[Syle]

Cool Dile, I'll post one here in a day or two. I think I am showing improvement from the last one you did, so it should be interesting at least.

[Alantyn]

Hey Dile!
Nice thread u got going on here, I am sure many artists would benefit alot from this.
I've been running around looking for feedback on this one, but haven't got much so I thought I'd come here bugging you for some help =)

The background is, in short: Lara Croft is deserted on an island. She's young and not yet the badass woman she becomes later on. I don't really know about this part, but it seems like shes looking for something in this place, we know she has a goal (and what we dont know cause the game aint out yet)

So in this piece I am trying to illustrate the calm before the she starts kicking ass (or rather gets kicked in the ass). The mountain at the back I want it to read like a goal, theres still a long way to get there. And I have some animals around, just adding some life into the piece.

Thanks for doing this for us.