Froud Tribute - Private Comission

[bbwolf]

okay for the first time I am pretty happy how things progress and I am cool with my shading the light sources and the values and the colours and everthing.
Its a private commission. I am not sure if i´d want to change major things in this comp atm but I am always open for pointers. Plus I would love some advice
how to make this the rainy drippy feel of the original sketch. I really want to keep that setting. I know the bright green well lit elf is totally bogus, but I am not
aiming for realistic depiction (its an ELF for crying out loud) but for a nice overall artistic feel. My problem is that ppl will be comming pretty close to it
and it will be 80 cm high.

Fire away!!!


cheeripo

[clifFroth]

I think perhaps you need to either make the umbrella leaf higher or his arm shorter so that the wave fits properly. I actually think the whole background looked better in the first image and got progressively weaker as you continued to render it. The mood was perfect and didn't need to be detailed.

[TinyBird]

Also if the little dude is under the leaf, why isn't there any cast shadow over him? And alternatively if there's light coming from the viewer's direction, why doesn't the little dude cast shadow to the leaf? Overall everything's lit kinda from everywhere, instead of one clear light source. Also if everything's very blue and cool in the background, don't use grey shadows in the actual creature, it just separates it from belonging to the environment.

[bbwolf]

Alright here we go. Thanks TinyBird and ClifFroth

I changed the arms of the little Fella. Prompted by Cliffs remark I measured them out and realized they´d be dragging around his ancles like a friggin Gibbon´s. I do understand the thing about the scene looking cooler with all the rain in the beginning, which is exactly wrote about that I would like to have some help to recreate that feel with more detail. Leaving as is - not a option as the painting will be pretty big and prominently displayed. Also stated previously. I attched a print size example to illustrate the size issue. I also changed the lighting but again, thanks TinyBird, and hope this is a bit more consistant, but again, this is not an Illustration that aims for Realistic showing off (its an ELF fer crying out loud, how real is that?) so some artistic and whimsical freedom is warrented and expected. Thanks for the tip with the greys though. I hope ya´ll can see that I changed some stuff accordingly. Already an improvement, I think.

Anybody got some advice on how I can get that wet rainy look?

[TinyBird]

Abut again, this is not an Illustration that aims for Realistic showing off (its an ELF fer crying out loud, how real is that?) so some artistic and whimsical freedom is warrented and expected.

If you're not aiming for anything realistic, then why are you doing realistic mushrooms, trying to render more realistic form to the elf, trying to get more realistic effects with rain and all that?
When you do all that in more realistic manner, but then randomly don't do some thing and break the consistency of your image, it really risks looking like a mistake and a flaw and any amount of crying about how it's an elf won't fix that. The elf might not be real in our world, but inside the world of the image, it is real.
If you didn't want to put a shadow over the elf, then it would have been better to make the composition and lighting or choose the style so that there wouldn't be a huge shadow over the elf.

[Theeroos]

Rain is similar to mist in how it creates a foggy and blurry atmosphere, that is why it looked better before you started detailing the background.
I also agree with Tinybird, even if it's not supposed to be 100% realistic, you still need it to be convincing. Right now you are not convincing me that he's actually standing under the leaf. Your excuse about it being an elf is weak, that's like saying he doesn't need convincing (not the same as realistic!) anatomy, because he doesn't really exist.
On that note, I think the way his left leg is twisted to the side doesn't look like a very natural/comfortable pose. It makes him look like he thinks he's a supermodel posing for the camera

[clifFroth]

It being big just means you need to tighten up the work, not add extraneous details.

[bbwolf]

well, I did take some of the advice given. No need to go on about advice I purposely did not take. I am not crying. I am just making a point for fun. (Elf)
To quote Adam Savage: "I reject your reality, and substitute my own!"
The pose and theme has been given to me by a client. As is the requested level of detail. Did you see the thing calling it a comission? I aim to please my customers.
Plus I already changed the pose. I am not opposed to changing it more.
I´d rather create an imaginary light source from the front, already did change some of the lighting to account for that? Did you see that?

So, maybe I should clarify, I would like to recieve some technical advice if possible on how to create the rain, please. I´d also be happy for links to a tutorial site or something.
If someone thinks they d have an idea about to improve the pose, feel free to do a quick paint over or share references. Thanks folks.

[clifFroth]

You are asking for advice on how to do what you have already done. The rain WAS created. You just painted over it.

[bbwolf]

maybe I should go and ask in a photoshop forum then, aye? If you do not have advice on what I ask, but can only repeat your twice rebuffed attempts on "not helping", please keep anyting else to yourself. I want to learn someting about technique. Photoshop tricks and wizardry. Filter frenzy, shortcuts, order of paint and stuff. How do I paint cool rain?

[TinyBird]

Photoshop tricks and wizardry. Filter frenzy, shortcuts, order of paint and stuff. How do I paint cool rain?

Maybe you should just learn to paint it? Search photos of rain, and paint studies of them, understand the effect behind the rain (how it affects colours and visibility, how light reflects through it, etc). Because rain isn't just some filter effect that you slap on a painting, especially if you have no idea what sort of rain effect you are wanting to make and probably just rebuff what we'd say more of the rain with "it's not meant to be realistic".
And I also agree with clifFroth, there was a sense of rain in the first image, not realistic but about equally convincing as the lighting on the elf, which you then took off.

[bbwolf]

I would love to learn to paint rain. Thats what I am asking about. I want to learn as much about if as there is. Any technique is good to know and then I can decide what mix of it makes the best rain for this pic. Any tips or insights? (how it affects colours and visibility, how light reflects through it, etc)
anybody knows someting about that they´d like to share? Or directions where I can find some information about it?

And my appologies to you for being concise about where I am open to listen to your advice, where not, and rebuffing atempts of "just paint it it as it was - and realism is a must".
I am willing to listen real advice, shared knowledge, oppinions, critique. And I already did take some of both of your advice so its not like I am impervious to suggestions, thats why I came here in the first place. So please do not go and expect what I am going to rebuff and why. I am listening, I am courteous, open and non insulting. But I have an objective and I do not like ppl putting advice out without backing it up. "Go and do studies" is not useful advice I am afraid. "Go and do studies and read this here and here and here" that is good advice.

I know that I need to learn about rain, I know there was rain in the first pic, but the orginal was in no way someting that would hold up with the final image size and I cant disregard that or I would be a lousy comercial illustrator. I would love to recreate the rainy feel and I will paint it in again. I just figured it would be much easier to add the detail of the background first and then paint it over. I will aim for the feel of the first sketch, even if that means omitting some of the painted in details.

[Mr. Corlan]

Hmm, there's a lot of words in here and not very many pictures. I must add my own smart-alec-ery. Try this.

As TinyBird said, get reference, look at it, learn to paint rain. Simple. But I'll do a little of your work for you; you've kinda got four things with rain: the raindrops, the splatter where they hit things, droplets sitting on things, and the high gloss of wet surfaces.

Now personally I do agree with your other critics here. I see no benefit in "stylization" that dispenses with proper light behavior. I mean, global illumination is the most beautiful thing in the world, why would you not want it? When you say you're not going for a "realistic depiction", I just read, "I don't know enough right now to manipulate proper lighting to fit my needs." Which is an acceptable, temporary, excuse—it's a commission, presumably you need to finish it in a timely manner. But "Temporary" is the key word here. There is no acceptable excuse for not learning to paint well.

Look at Bobby Chiu, Daniel Lieske, Sam Nielson, and Peleng. The all do more or less stylized, cartoony subjects, but execute them in a brilliant, realistic manner.

You also might want to show some depth-of-field since you're dealing with such a small subject.

[bbwolf]

MrCorlan

Thank you VERY much for that insight- and helpful post and the quick paint over. That is all very enlighting. (Though i have aquired quiet the collection of rain pictures, even took some myself )
The depth of field is a very good tip thanks again.
Plus I stated before that I have objection against learning new tricks, I love to learn new tricks. Temporary, yes, Timeline, deadline, budget etc.
But yes, eventually I wanna be able to do things right without having to think about it much. Again your post has been a huge help, thank you for that.

Here´s what i had time to do today, just a little bit and it looks like I will need to to some changes to it now. I have a bit more time to put into this thing after all.