Archiving your Work

[JOELB]

Hey Everyone,

So I don't know if I am putting this in the right place or not, but here goes nothing.

Since we are all either digital artists or have copies of our work in digital form I wanted to create a thread where we can all share how we back up our work.

Recently I had a series of disasters that wiped out all of my work (just 6 years of my life nothing big). Now that I am getting my footing again and starting to create I want to share some ideas, hopefully sparing others the pain of losing their work.

Okay so this is what I do to back up/ protect my work. I have an extra hard drive where I put all of the files that I am not working on. Then in a separate location I have a bunch of dvds of my work.

A separate location is a must it is likely that a disaster won't hit both places at once. If it does you will have bigger problems to worry about.

Hard Drives are great. they can hold lots of data and can rewrite as much as you'd want. The downside is they usually only last about 5 years on average sometimes a bit more or less. Also they need to be turned on and spun up once or twice a year or they cease to work.

Which is why I choose dvds for the separate location (I didn't want to have a HD shipped to me so I can turn it on). dvds are great because unless they're damaged the data will be there. Downside again is that they only last about 5 years so you have to reburn the disks every so often which could get tedious.

What do you think? How do you archive your work?

[furiana]

What about a flash drive? How long do those things last?

[QueenGwenevere]

I've always used CDs rather than DVDs, they seem to last a pretty long time (I've got a bunch of CDs that are well over ten years old and they still work fine.)

I've been toying with the idea of using one of those online storage services... but I haven't researched this yet so I have no idea which ones are any good, or how much they cost.

[JOELB]

furiana flash drives are great. Solid state drives have no moving parts so they last a long time.

Though they haven't been around long so who actually knows if their tests on them are accurate.

The trick with them is that there are only a certain number of reads and writes before you can't use them. While the number varies it's probably somewhere between 10,000 to 100,000.

I haven't seen any real difference between the lifetime of a cd and a dvd. I have used dvds that are 10 years old, but have also run into cds and dvds that are useless after 3 years. I think it all has to do with the manufacturer. All dvds/cds are not created equal.

Queen Gwenevere I also thought of online storage. However you have to pay every month and I wasn't sure I wanted to add another monthly fee.

Most say you have unlimited storage from $5- $25.

Does anyone else have some experience with Online Storage?

[Riley Stark]

We have a (headless) home server that backs up everything on my computer each morning @ 6am (because I'm never up then so it just runs and is done by the time I do get up). There's some way that my husband set it up that it backs up on one drive and then it backs up certain parts on another drive kind of like a ghost image of the files or something. I'm not entirely sure what it's called (I know there's a term, but I can't think of it at the moment..), but I'm happy as long as it works. (He handles all the tech stuff around here.. It's his hobby and he enjoys it, which is fine with me because it's not really my thing.LOL)

I know a few people who do the online backup services and they're pretty happy with those. They aren't really expensive either. I suppose there's something comforting about having copies somewhere else that isn't your house.. If something crazy happens like a fire or your stuff gets stolen, then you still have copies that nothing can happen to elsewhere..

[Arshes Nei]

furiana flash drives are great. Solid state drives have no moving parts so they last a long time.

Though they haven't been around long so who actually knows if their tests on them are accurate.

The trick with them is that there are only a certain number of reads and writes before you can't use them. While the number varies it's probably somewhere between 10,000 to 100,000.

No they've been around for a while, what is new is that they're being released for the consumer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solid-state_drive

If you have your own website, you can also use online storage in that way. I keep my backups on several drives and replace them after a certain amount of years. Some items are kept on dvd cd backups, but I learned to keep smaller chunks of data in various places.

[ikken]

a lot of my archival dvds went unreadable after probably 3 or 4 years of simply lying on the shelf, never been exposed to direct sunlight or moisture/temperature drops.
CD/hdd backups are more reliable in my opinion.

[Auslander]

Does anyone else have some experience with Online Storage?

I've been using ADrive and don't have too many complaints. They don't mention that you can "only" upload the lesser of either 1000 files or 1GB a data in one go if you're using the "free" storage (seven bucks a month gets you FTP). Sometimes the Java upload applet hangs or crashes, and if you're taking the freebie, you have to track your file changes yourself, but Cloud storage makes you effectively theft, fire, loss, etc. proof, unlike a portable or a thumb drive.

Biggest risk: if the hosting company goes under (NEVER delete the original from your own drive!). Something like that happened with an image-hosting company a few years back, and thousands of users lost millions of photos. There's other services too, so shop around...

Pretty much the wave of the future, methinks...in a few years, thumb and portable drives will seem as quaint as floppies...

[JOELB]

Thanks Auslander, I have also heard great things about Mozy from friends. If you sign up for 2 years it'll only cost you around $104, the cheapest I've seen so far.

Hard drives are the cheapest option overall if you have a friend that will hold onto it for you. Especially since you can get a terabyte for around $70.

According to google, after your hard drive has a smart status scan error, you have around 60 days before it fails. Also the majority of hard drive's smart statuses won't give you a heads up on when it will fail. Here is a less technical version of the google report.

I have had hard drives last 2-15 years. The one I have now has lasted me 10 years and survived a fire. So it seems that it's anyone's guess when your hard drive will fail and it's best to have two copies of every file.

I did some math and figured out that if you wanted to store 1 TB of data for 25 years it would cost you:

$1,300 with Mozy
$270 on DVD-R (That's if you burned a new disc every 10 years. The manufacturers claim 35-100 years from what I've seen. Personally I use Memorex and have had no problems)
$250 on a Hard Drive

Though theoretically, perhaps the absolutely cheapest would be on flash drive. From what I've heard flash drives can't fail mechanically. So you write it, put it in a safe place, and it's good forever. The cost then is irrelevant since you will never need to buy another one unless tragedy strikes or usb ports become archaic.

Does anyone know if there are statistics for the lifespan of flash drives?

What do you think the best way to archive all your work would be?

[Auslander]

I did some math and figured out that if you wanted to store 1 TB of data for 25 years it would cost you:

$1,300 with Mozy
$270 on DVD-R (That's if you burned a new disc every 10 years. The manufacturers claim 35-100 years from what I've seen. Personally I use Memorex and have had no problems)
$250 on a Hard Drive

Don't forget Moore's Law...as drives continue to plummet in price, the services offering cloud storage will decrease in cost as well. I'd wager that by 2015, you'll be able to store 1 TB online for free, probably as a promotion for some other online venture, like whatever Facebook turns into by that time ("Now join FriendFace and get up to 5 TB of FREE storage space!").

Google's also pushing hard for a cloud OS version of Chrome, where all your apps and data are stored elsewhere...all you need is a browser to access it. And (of course) a belief that Google isn't out to take over the world, starting with your private information...

On a side note, I've never trusted either recordable CDs or DVDs as a "permanent" storage medium since a friend of mine showed me what happens if you put one in a microwave oven for 2 seconds...

BRRRZZZAPPP...now you have a pop art coaster...

[ErikHolfelder]

One issue that I've heard with solid state drives is that they are more easily corruptible -- though I've never had a flash drive corrupt a file without doing something stupid to it (as far as I can remember).

Mines similar to others, 2 hard drives, one for backup, then a third in a fireproof safe (instead of off site). I'd like to get more secure though, this feels a little precarious still. I may ftp to my server or look into an online service. This thread might give me some ideas...

[nofu]

I've also had bad experiences with losing a lot of data so my dad set up a home server and it regularly backs up all our stuff (that we have assigned to be backed up). I also have most of my essential stuff on a few flash drives. Bad thing about them is that they are small and easily lost even if you think you alway keep them carefully in one place. I had one that just disappeared from my drawer, never took it anywhere.

[Randis]

DVD works just fine for me, it is easy to store and easier to transport than hard drives, by the time they expire we surely will have something new again.

[JOELB]

Don't forget Moore's Law...as drives continue to plummet in price, the services offering cloud storage will decrease in cost as well.

A solid point Auslander, I would even expect that in the next 10- 20 years we have a whole new way of storing data. Cloud storage is interesting and the more I learn about it the more it seems the most convenient offsite option.

For those with pcs you might want to look into P2P Backup. It's a p2p backup service that once you join puts your files on someone elses computer to store. They encrypt it so in theory the other users can't use/view it.

The most exciting thing I've seen for cloud storage is Carbonite. You can get 5 years unlimited storage for $200.

One issue that I've heard with solid state drives is that they are more easily corruptible -- though I've never had a flash drive corrupt a file without doing something stupid to it (as far as I can remember).

Mines similar to others, 2 hard drives, one for backup, then a third in a fireproof safe (instead of off site). I'd like to get more secure though, this feels a little precarious still. I may ftp to my server or look into an online service. This thread might give me some ideas...

I've heard the same thing. Flash drives are funny you can't get a straight answer on how long they last. I did find this though. I found a couple other sites saying the same thing. Basically for flash drives they expect you to use the read/write limit before age becomes a factor. Age wise they say the data can stay on there around 10 years. If that's true then there is no reason to use it to backup or archive data. Dvds and hard drives are cheaper and would last just as long.

Though if anyone has some solid info on this feel free to share.

eekolite how does your safe due with protection from heat? My thinking is that it would be nice not to have to backup offsite, but it's not just the flames but also the heat that could destroy the media in the safe.

I wish we could get one of the heavy hitters to join in on this. I can't help but feel that those who have been doing digital art for a long time would have already crossed this bridge and would have valuable advice on this.

[Baron Impossible]

Saw a TV show recently where it said some DVDs become unreadable after a year. Certainly a good quality HD, well maintained, will last longer than a DVD on average, and obviously hold a lot more. My internet connection is not yet fast enough for remote backup (although they've given me the option to upgrade to 20Gb for free other people have noted it's unreliable) so I use HD backup.

Every month I make a full backup onto drive 2. Every day I do an incremental backup onto that backup set. And every two weeks I do another full backup onto drive 3. A full backup of 20Gb only takes a few minutes and the incremental back-up, scanning for any file that has been changed, takes on average 10 seconds. I use velociraptor drives, though, which makes a massive difference.

[Noah Bradley]

Since I'm still in school and my life follows a semester schedule, it's quite easy for me to back up all of my current work online. I'm too cheap to pay for backing up everything, so the current files save me from any catatrophic loss. I like Dropbox, as it's much easier to get at your documents from other computer than some of the other online back-up sites.

True story: I actually had a harddrive crash this past semester. If I hadn't already backed up my files online, I would've been screwed. Thankfully I did.

[QueenGwenevere]

Hmm... the free Dropbox service does look handy for keeping small backups of current work (I'm using a flash drive for that now, an extra backup offsite would be good.)

Man, I'm bookmarking all these storage sites.

[JOELB]

The more I look at it the more that it seems the media doesn't matter too much.

All of them roughly have the same lifetime and the same risks. I guess in the end all you need to really worry about is to have at least 2 copies, 1 copy in a separate location, and something that works for you.

Unless that is someone has a brilliant idea we missed.

[Sacari]

I used to keep a nice, organized back-up on a CD. Worked great, held a ton.
But in the last few years I've gotten lazy... My work is spread out over a few memory sticks and SD cards. Yea, not the best idea.
I just got my new laptop and I'm using that as an incentive to go through all my computer stuffs, get it organized and then back it up. I'm lucky nothing has crashed and died yet...
I'll probably back it up on either a USB stick or a CD. They work fairly well for me.

[NickTrip]

I have a little usb hard drive that automatically "syncs" when I plug it into my computer. So the idea is that I use both my computer and the external everyday to back up my work, and then if one happens to fail, I know to replace it quickly to ensure my work is backed up. Of course this doesn't protect against physical catastrophe like a fire, but I work mostly traditionally so I can't really back up and protect my work anyway...;P

[nauvice]

online storage seems the safest. try dropbox.com, it's basically a folder on your computer, and anything you put in it automatically uploads online. you get 2gb for free, but you can get up to 5gb for free if you recommend it (through a given link) to your friends and they use the service. Or you can pay per month for way larger sizes.

[JOELB]

yea I am up to over 20 gb so far and cost wise I can't afford online storage. I also have an external HD that I use to back up too. But after a fire and another catastrophe I firmly believe in having something offsite.

I have lost all of my work twice.

[Parka81]

I would recommend harddisk over DVDs anytime.

DVDs can deteriorate after a few years. I've a few that were unreadable in a few spots (cyclic redundancy error).

Definitely go for harddisk and online storage.

[JOELB]

I agree, but how easy would it be to use them for offsite backup as well?

I have my offsite backup in another state so I have been mailing dvds out.

So I guess the question is can a HD be light enough to not cost a fortune and durable to make it through the mail?