Feng Zhu School of Design

[Deadlyhazard]

I'm thinking of applying to there in a year or so. That, or art center. My work isn't a 1/5 as good as it should be, but that's because I've really just started drawing 5 months ago and painting about 2-3 weeks ago. For any current international students...is it worth the 40,000 SGD? That's an insane amount of money!

[LastGen]

I guess you have to pay 40.000 SGD for school, but what do you pay for a residence? Maybe someone who´s international student could say how much you have to calculate to spend one year in singapore =)

[phats]

WILSON'S right get your shit together sooner rather then later .. even if you not 100% sure you will attend .. the process takes some time.. took me 1 year to get in .. i originally applied to get into the june 2009 intake .. but didn't get accepted till june 2010 intake..

btw its 4am here and i'm just finishing a painting assignment i been working on since friday evening...

haha wilson... friday .. what happened man?.. every one was dead

[JawadAyub]

Guys who are studying in feng zhu, is this school any better for design school. Do they teach more about design sense and how to make believable characters enviroments and props. Judging from the gallery the style of every student is same. Do you find yourself better than before you joined the school? How did you guys manage 40,000 and how are you trying to live over there with other necessities? Any job over there?

[Wilsondf]

Hello, like before anything i say is just my own personal opinion and

hopefully its informative.

@saprissa9 - characters, backround, etc... everything you see when you

open a concept art book the school will tackle. and even some projects

that are product/industrial design based (meaning they actually have to

be buildable and can function)

1) As for practice the best advice I can suggest is to practice the

things that I used to hate and be bored at when opening a How To Book

about drawing. The Fundamentals and Basics of drawing

. Of course the first term will teach this stuff but you'd

improve much faster if your already know them. This is a safeguard than

attending the school knowing completely nothing about drawing.

If your not used to drawing these it might be tough and your confidence

level might drop down early on.

2) Get used to Photoshop and drawing on the Wacom as well as being

comfortable drawing with Pen and Paper.

3) Get used to handle criticism constructively - Think that your art

directors are employers giving you a project to do. If you don't do your

job or follow instructions expect to hear what a very unhappy employer

that gave you a one week deadline will say. True, you can't get fired

but not because we paid 40,000 SGD you expect to hear dissaproval in "a

nice way". You came to this school to learn, not to hear Feng and the

art directors praise your work and get pissed if they think its not good

enough.

Honestly I entered the school with a plan like "Impress Feng and he will

give me a job" kinda mentality becaue I already have drawing experience

that was so dillusional until I learned that "hey, I'm here to learn

skills and improve my designs so I'll just do my best work, sometimes it

might not be as awesome as I imagined it but I will seek improvement." An

attitude which works better for me. If I was really that good already I

didn't have to phony up the big tuition for this school.

Do it for yourself.

The school trains you to be ready in a studio requirement.. to be

professional.

@DeadlyHazard - For me its worth it, also depends how you see it. Early

on I was dissapointed because my work never turns out as good as Feng's

demo's and kinda bummed me for a bit but I looked back at old drawings

and I saw that now I can draw perspective better and can actually draw a

vehicle (which I never draw before) and I can understand digital painting

more naturally right now than all the video tutorials I keep amassing.

I'm one of those guys that have to enter a school to learn, my progress

via self studying was so slow compared to the first 8 weeks at FZD

One of the best part is, all those tutorials you have.. you can

understand them much better.

I'm from Asia so 40,000 SGD was a lot of money (like 2 Korean cars) it

took some planning and a lot of saving (I waited a year but I worked in

Singapore in an architectural firm already) plus support from family.

The course is only one year so its quite fast which fits my timetable.

@LastGen - yeah for me 40,000 SGD plus maybe 15,000 SGD 12 month

allowance. This is just for living expenses... not including if you

fancy an art book suddenly, etc....

For residence from what I've heard if you want to live near the school I

think the average is 2000+ SGD for one room in an apartment or something

and you might have roomates sharing the place.

But I don't have the budget to live near the school with an apartment

just for myself... so....

I live 45 minutes away from school via MRT but only have to split 800SGD

rent a month with my roomate. total apartment rent at my area is 1800

which I split with 4 housemates. So I live off 1500 SGD allowance per

month including electric bill, train fare and food.

The apartment rent is the biggest thing to consider budget wise.

@JawadAyub - regarding Design Sense.. its a pretty subjective thing. FZD

teaches you how to come up with unique shapes and all those techniques

where to get inspiration for shapes but its still your own judgement if:

a) You design looks cool
b) Your proportions are comfortable to the eye

The art directors will give comments but ultimately your the one deciding

what design your going to hand in looks like. They will suggest areas of

improvement but they will not enumerate all the things you have to change

until your design looks cool. You have to know yourself if it looks

right. They will not do the job for you.

Try copying existing vehicles or appliances exactly even in side view or

perspective. You might think you copied it exactly but when you show it

someone who's good at drawing they might see major errors in proportions

like the distance or size between car wheels are way off. For short, your

eye can't tell if your drawing "looks" wrong even if your quite familiar

seeing a car everyday. That might affect how you design in a major way

since even sci fi vehicles or fantasy characters take proportions from

existing objects like a normal car or human.

As for the job.... have a definite plan... After graduation I'll probably

spend a month or two preparing a portfolio, etc. Study and do really

well at school first as priority. Thinking about getting a job is

second. Mentally if I think about it too much I might end up a

perfectionist in my homeworks because "This has to be super awesome or

else I won't get work" attitudes will get me nowhere, not saying its a

bad thing to over achieve but in reality there is waaay to much homework

and I might not get anything done well. Being a perfectionist while

still needing to improve and learn some skills might not mix well (for me

that is). You might end up a nervous wreak.

Whoa that was long..... I have a life drawing sketchbook due in.... 4

hours ... 5 pages worth...

Also I think Internationals can get in again for the... February term..

so guys... ask around. because I know the school is getting the

international license assesed presently. Hope to see more internationals

by next term to share the fun and suffering with.

[Wilsondf]

Also for those wondering why the gallery works looks it done by the same person:

a) chances are they are indeed done by the same person - sometimes the school has a student who outdo's the rest and those are the works that get posted on the website.

b) The projects they hand out are not individual but by class.

c) Those who've just started drawing might emulate how the art directors draw.

d) They look the same because the school is focused on a "product design" approach/look/presentation that will be handed out to 3d modelers and clients or art directors. not the illustrations style that goes to pinups and book covers.

[JawadAyub]

@Wilsonf

Wow dude thanks for the input you giving, please keep us updated i still think 40,000 SGD is too expensive . They should offer installment method what TAD is doing right now which is a bit of an ease for students.
Anyway have you met any graduate students from 2009 who are doing work and got a job? One more thing does the institute focus on color theory life drawing sessions of human and composition? My portfolio kinda sucks it focus mostly on characters n couple of envrioment. Is that going to be a problem to join a school?

[Wilsondf]

@JawadAyub - for internationals you don't have to pay it in one go, its kind of installment 20k before school starts and 20k again by I think end of December.

40,000 SGD is no joke, so really have a gameplan when you decide to enter the school. If you think TAD is much better, I say go for it. I came to FZD because its just 3 hours away from my country and I like the 1 year timespan.

As for the the graduates 70% are already hired for the first batch, one got to work in Singapore as a concept designer for MMO RPG's. I heard one got in Ruin Entertainment.

Color Theory, not sure, I'm still in my second term but we do a lot of Production Painting. Initially the school trains you to see depth and value using greyscale first (like 15 scene paintings each week for 4 weeks in my Batch's case just to nail depth perception using value)

Life Drawing class - during my first term they introduced figure drawing lessons every friday after class and just last we had our first life drawing session for 2 and a half hours with a model which is free if you sign up

Composition - you mean scene composition that falls under Feng's class in term 2. He'll teach you how to make a camera shot work.

I had figures and a couple of environments for my portfolio to so I guess its no problem. You could try emailing the school about their acceptance, etc since that's already internal stuff. In the forums I can only how's my experience.

[LastGen]

Thanks for replying to the questions, I appreciate that! =)
You said you have a lot of homework to do. Another artist said he didn´t get enough sleep, his first weeks seemed to be like a torture...can you share that experience? I mean of course you want to draw when you go to an art school, but I don´t think it´s that effective when you have to stay up till next morning to finish your work under such a pressure and this for almost every single week at school.

[andres333]

Wilsondf: thank you so much for your answers, it's exactly what i was expecting when I started this thread

[kevlineuh]

Thank you for comments, it's interesting above all the part of the money for me.
And I think it's almost impossible for me lol 35000€, with 2 years of a fulltime job I can't earn that with the theory that I live in my family house and nothing to buy while +2 years, and if I consider to find a job here it's nearly impossible lol. What a pity I really like concept design, I'll continue by myself even if that takes lot of years to be good (because in my head this kind of school can really speed up your skills).
Again thank you for your replies and good luck !

[Deadlyhazard]

@Wilsonf

Wow dude thanks for the input you giving, please keep us updated i still think 40,000 SGD is too expensive . They should offer installment method what TAD is doing right now which is a bit of an ease for students.
Anyway have you met any graduate students from 2009 who are doing work and got a job? One more thing does the institute focus on color theory life drawing sessions of human and composition? My portfolio kinda sucks it focus mostly on characters n couple of envrioment. Is that going to be a problem to join a school?

Agreed. It's much too expensive, you can get a cheaper and just as good if not better education at Art Center (if you factor in scholarships and grants). The second FZD offers international scholarships and grants, I'm sold.

[JawadAyub]

@ DeadlyHazard:

FZD doesnot offer scholarships and grants i just got it confirm by one of their faculty's member at FZD. FZD would be better choice for me because it's in Asia and easy for me to travel aswell but the fees and other expenses like food and accommodation will be difficult to manage. Anyway people who are living in USA, Art Center is best choice for them instead of traveling all way to asia side and spending a year on it.

[Wilsondf]

its 2 am and I"m still doing a second detailed interior perspective due in 8 hours ...

@LastGen - glad you asked about the no sleep pressured scheduled. Yeah, it was a shocker. I'll admit the school is hardcore in that sense, so hardcore that not even touching your work for a day can screw up your pace and you have to makeup for it big time.

So for those who get sick easily from lack of sleep or stress be very prepared.

Term 1 we have to submit 5 sheets on 11 x 17 paper each day(not just one big drawing in one but a lot)

But I heard from Feng that when he was attending Art Centre the he got more homeworks than he's giving us and the instructors are more scary hehe (better ask people attending there how's their workload)

I think the tough schedule and time demands makes or breaks the students, most of the time by friday we look like hell and just sleep for a bit when we get home and wake up early to work on next weeks assignments.

Full dedication for 1 year is what students has to give.

The school is set in a more extreme studio environments, like deadlines for each day of the week, to make us commit fully to the course (I rarely get to go out and have fun or watch movies, etc) and to make us faster because in a normal design studio setup, no one is going to ask you to submit 25 pages of assigned task per week, so when do get jobs it wouldn't be that hard, and we're so much faster.

Of course, I do fall behind sometimes... hey, we're only human. After awhile I got to accept that's its the way it is.

ok.. back to homework...I'm still having fun though, drawing is my anti stress back when I was working. I hope I'm not scaring anyone off.. just being honest...

[JawadAyub]

@ Wilsondf:

Glad you enjoying the FZD, suck up all the info while you can in this 1 year. Anyway how about post some of your progression of your art if it's ok for you. =]

[doodlingdragon]

Hooray it's wilson!

I'm in wilson's batch too. I had previous art experience as an illustrator so all this hardcore science and design stuff was a bit of a shock for me. Add to the mix that I am extremely nervous about mech and tech stuff and it makes things a little tricky. But no matter! I shall improve over time!

[phats]

i would recommend your 210% sure you want to attend. tuition cost is minimal if your mind set is already there .. lets put it in perspective.. your on a tropical island .. studying under feng.
he encourages questions .. and you grow. i see it in my class mates as well as my self .. one will know right away there understanding of perspective skyrockets.. so fast .. you may feel overwhelmed by the home work .. it isn't till you sit down and start doing it .. you realize .. "oh yah ok "..

growing is always up to the student.. those who fuck around and waste time .. seem to forget why they are here.. thats ok .. it is what it is.. but those that constantly apply what is taught .. grow so fast its hard to keep up.

look at your options .. concept design is hella competitive now.. every day some one shows me some 19 yo wiz kid art center guru .. that makes me question my existence... you can go to TAD or ART CENTER..FZD or what ever else is out there .. hell you don't even need to go to school.. But unless your 210% dedicated to it .. it don't matter .. who cares about resume.

for those starting out .. if it were me knowing what i know.. i would take some drawing classes .
force my self to get into the mindset. study life as much as possible ... can't stress that enough .. get real pictures .. your own not google.. start building that mental library .. draw every thing . as much as possible .. stay away from anime or art of books...get model kits all that shit that makes you see things better.

as for the fzd gallery .. that is honestly a fraction of the work that gets produced .. some of my classmates have yet to show case there works on the site and its absolutely phenomenal .. i will post closer to graduation my works ..

set our goals.. if you feel like your just starting out .. then really get into it .. use your frustration as your motivation and excel.. if your exp.. then put what you know to the side and retrace what you may already know.

[JawadAyub]

@Phats

I might be coming to FZD but for certificate courses to test out how they teach. Are those courses worth it? If you know anyone who is studying that? I can manage the diploma 1 year fees but i'm much worried about other expenses like acommodation and food i heard singapore is hella expensive in that case, you can't work right on the student visa. =[ I really wish to join you guys !!!

[andres333]

look at your options .. concept design is hella competitive now.. every day some one shows me some 19 yo wiz kid art center guru .. that makes me question my existence... you can go to TAD or ART CENTER..FZD or what ever else is out there .. hell you don't even need to go to school.. But unless your 210% dedicated to it .. it don't matter .. who cares about resume.

It's nice to hear this kind of comment, makes me believe in myself even more
i infinitely appreciate it

[Wilsondf]

yeah you don't really need to go to any school if you put dedication in. Everything is available in the internet.

Its just that when a budding or aspiring concept artists want to get better and finds out there are schools like FZD they might think "If only I could get into those schools" kinda thinking, they just might forget that these skills can be self taught.

[Wilsondf]

@Jawadayub - FZD Progress...the school really doesn't want us to post our designs before we graduate, but design wise I honestly don't think these are gonna make it in any movies or games because I focused on the Painting part for this homework. Not perfect but definitely better.

I think there's one Brazillian who took the certificate courses. I really haven't gotten any input from those taking it since we almost never interact - different class schedules.

1st pic - actually part of my portfolio reviews, I was purely a sketcher before

2nd to 3rd - after 4 months of school.

[Maledict]

Thanks for taking the time out of your busy schedules to talk about the school, phats and Wilson .

I'm super pumped to go, gonna mail my documents when Monday comes around. I think I can handle the workload. The only problem I can forsee is my sleep cycle. I currently take medication for my mild schizophrenia, and the medication completely knocks me out. I usually have no problem staying up - it's getting up after sleep that's the problem for me. For example: I had an alarm clock RIGHT NEXT TO MY HEAD ring for about 20 minutes, and it didn't even wake me up or register for me. It did, however, wake up my mother who was in a completely different room. I'll go to my doctor soon and see if we can change the medication or something to one that's less sleepy.

But anyway, thanks for taking the time to educate us n00bs .

[saprissa9]

thank you wilson for your time.

[doodlingdragon]

@sparissa9

Start practicing those vehicles and hard edge stuff already! Being illustration/animation trained makes it harder for me in the sense that I tend to stylise things a lot and I don't draw detail very well.

Though I AM working my way around it and am looking forward to being able to draw believable mech stuff soon!

[phats]

Yeah .. we don't draw weapons.. you don't draw weapons at FZD .. unless it in a sketch book
and the school has asked us not to post our work until were done. this is asia and a lot of rips happen.. none the less some students still post works.. why i have no clue...

If your thinking of taking the night class .. yah i think that s a good idea .. you just learn all the JAZZ and not really the technical we learn .. thats kinda up to you .. def lighten up the load.

if your on meds or suffering from what ever .. gotta get over it Fast .. 1st month i was having panic attacks so much .. i thought it was fucking hart burn .. cus i never had them before.. when my work would crash at 8 am and its due at 10 am .. i Still pulled through .. But fuck me .. how do you tell feng your work is corrupted.. you don't .. you back the fuck up all the time ..


If your noob .. i recommend you log off fb .. msn .. all that bull shit and go to the library and draw from book and life non stop .. nothing feels worse then looking over your shoulder and your classmate is drawing some well though out design with flawless perspective and super tight line work.. and your drawing looks like a can of minced assholes .. get your confidence up in your abilities .. Can't stress this enough it's a design school .. your studying hybrid industrial design. getting better at drawing is really on the students own time.. they give you the know how.. up to you to apply it to your current level.. adapt or slide

school will post a video soon answering some international questions .. stay posted for that ..

[Deadlyhazard]

Yeah .. we don't draw weapons.. you don't draw weapons at FZD .. unless it in a sketch book
and the school has asked us not to post our work until were done. this is asia and a lot of rips happen.. none the less some students still post works.. why i have no clue...

If your thinking of taking the night class .. yah i think that s a good idea .. you just learn all the JAZZ and not really the technical we learn .. thats kinda up to you .. def lighten up the load.

if your on meds or suffering from what ever .. gotta get over it Fast .. 1st month i was having panic attacks so much .. i thought it was fucking hart burn .. cus i never had them before.. when my work would crash at 8 am and its due at 10 am .. i Still pulled through .. But fuck me .. how do you tell feng your work is corrupted.. you don't .. you back the fuck up all the time ..


If your noob .. i recommend you log off fb .. msn .. all that bull shit and go to the library and draw from book and life non stop .. nothing feels worse then looking over your shoulder and your classmate is drawing some well though out design with flawless perspective and super tight line work.. and your drawing looks like a can of minced assholes .. get your confidence up in your abilities .. Can't stress this enough it's a design school .. your studying hybrid industrial design. getting better at drawing is really on the students own time.. they give you the know how.. up to you to apply it to your current level.. adapt or slide

school will post a video soon answering some international questions .. stay posted for that ..

O'rly?

Anyone have links of student portfolios (pre-FZD AND were accepted)? I want to measure up where I need to get my skill level in a year.

And what do you mean you need to draw on your own time? Don't you draw/paint at the school while learning from the teachers?

And uhh....how many hours of sleep do you get a day exactly? Like, considering if you manage your time perfectly? Like Wilson gave an example earlier in the thread, sleeping at 6AM and waking up at 10AM for school....is that just bad time management or is it seriously that intense?

[Maledict]

O'rly?

Anyone have links of student portfolios (pre-FZD AND were accepted)? I want to measure up where I need to get my skill level in a year.

Here is my portfolio that I've just submitted. I was originally planning to go in October last year (Of which this was the portfolio I used), but they had issues with certificates/licenses/stuff for bringing in internationals, so I've had to wait.

And what do you mean you need to draw on your own time? Don't you draw/paint at the school while learning from the teachers?

I'd actually like to know this as well. But from what I've gathered from emails, the internet, etc - The instructors give lectures in the morning, and then students do the work for the rest of the day (I think - please correct me if I'm wrong). The school "closes" at 5pm officially, but they let students stay until 10pm (This is what I've gathered from emails with Ms. Jungying).

[Wilsondf]

@ Deadlyhazard and @ Rabi

I don't think student portfolios pre-FZD are available anywhere unless they give it to you themselves. I've posted my Deviantart gallery earlier so I guess that was my level before FZD.

As for working time for schoolwork - it really depends, but mostly on Design Subjects, here's the deal. There's 18 of you in class submitting pages homework each week and getting critiqued, the critiques aren't one on one. Sometimes you have to present (and defend) your work in front of the class. The reason is to get you used to presentations. Sometimes your not allowed to work on your homework while your classmates are presenting (its just rude). To get through those 18 people eats up a chunk of time plus Art Directors lectures (which you might be able to work on your stuff but you might miss out on the lesson) at the most extreme lectures plus presentations end after lunch or 4pm at the most, but that's for Design subjects. That's why we stay beyond the 5PM up to the 10PM limit. The real basis IMHO is - the population of your class. Previous batch's had only 10 or less students mine's the biggest 18!

But I've seen time management solve this a lot (which you should really have). As for me staying up until 6AM and being in school at 10AM its either, I mismanaged my time or I'm trying to submit my work on a higher finish level. The school is meant to be intense for a reason.

Hope that helps

[Wilsondf]

Also.. a lot of us internationals even when we got accepted waited for a year before starting in FZD...

If I could turn back time I would've taken a few drawing classes, anything that forces me to draw regularly than just waiting for school to start.

@Deadlyhazard - I really wouldn't worry about portfolio, you'd be surprised how diverse the student background is, some include not even drawing at all. If your really passionate and know what your getting yourself into I don't think it would be a problem.

[phats]

O'rly?

Anyone have links of student portfolios (pre-FZD AND were accepted)? I want to measure up where I need to get my skill level in a year.

And what do you mean you need to draw on your own time? Don't you draw/paint at the school while learning from the teachers?

And uhh....how many hours of sleep do you get a day exactly? Like, considering if you manage your time perfectly? Like Wilson gave an example earlier in the thread, sleeping at 6AM and waking up at 10AM for school....is that just bad time management or is it seriously that intense?

link to portfolio submitted.. http://dave.magestick.com/ prior to fzd.. coming from canada

bad time management only fucks you up..
realistically they give you more home work then you can handle .. Art center does the same thing. cept i herd art center is way more intense then fzd...
but i imaging FZD will continue to raise the bar in terms of home work for its students.
so its more less.. for me
not enough time in the day .. do a little test .. draw me oh lets say a train design .. Don't look at any anime or game stuff.. look at real world reference... draw 5 pages a3 of design ideas based on your reference. 50 thumbnail designs then further you top 5 three times. pick the best 3
and do a rough presentation pages support your designs with support drawings..ex.. if your door opens up a certin way then you need to show it..
can't just say my design does this this and this.. with out the back up.. lay out perspective and value renders are also required.
you find problems with current "designs" and find solutions .. support those solutions with drawings

oh yeah u can use photoshop .. but no shift key .. all lines must be free handed in .. feng don't use shift nore do the lectures .. so were taught the same.

also 5 pages of pro looking sketch book subject like heavy machinery .. nothing graphical .. or stylized .. but rather realistic reference . using perspective , value and proper lay out. drawings must look Pro. take your time.

time your self see how long that takes.. now thats just one class ..
you have 3 more.

lets say your week in a area like drawing faces.. or hands .. then you need to find time to fit in..
for my self right now its my penmenship in ps .. prior to fzd i never used a tablet .. every thing was done with mouse.. so i'm getting better but .. still feel its one day at a time.. lectures do offer me advice on exercises to over come my problem..

i think you could realistically wrap your days up at 1 -2 am every day if your super efficient. but ever now and then you get stuck .. or just need a nap or break .. so that plugs up a bit of time...
It's as intense as you want it to be i guess.. your really want to push it then they encourage it .. but if you don't then it shows in your work.. they will rip into stuff and tell you no lies when they see bad work.. its good .. its why i came here.. i have no life .. fzd.. sleep .. gym on saturday.. fzd.. sleep ..

i think when you get your phone interview they tell you how its gonna be.. pretty much exactly how they told me..

hope that helps..