When Darkness Falls -- Purged

[Snitchcat]

Preparing for a new start.

[Maridius]

Hi! Now that I sucked you into CA I better be nice and be the first poster for your sketchbook. I'm sure we can find ways to torment each other into sketching on a regular basis, such as bumping one another's thread with 72 pt. reminders to DRAW already. The free world depends on it. At least that's how we should conduct ourselves. You know there's a member here (I'll have to look around to find her again) who does both sketching and plushies? So if you want to share your smilies too don't be shy.

Is that an upside down message in the lower right hand corner *squints*

My eyes aren't that good you know! :p

Um--only major crit I have is the top left guy's left arm seems uncomfortably high for the angle you've drawn him.

Oh and your catwoman has NO WHISKERS!!!!!!! Sorry couldn't resist.

[Maridius]

Long legs are long The upper body is in proportion and it kind of looks like he's got long nails, though that could be sketch lines so I won't mention them I'm hoping to see more blood from you in the future and plenty of agony, so push those facial expressions! You need tears to wash down a bloodbath.

[Maridius]

Are the arrows at the shoulders so you can narrow them? I'll always crit on the side of realism because I don't know manga so if very broad shoulders are the right style, ignore me. Right now he looks like a boy who's been trying on his father's battle gear--the gaps in the collar also give that impression. He just needs a larger neck and head to be in proportion and you're good to go. The costume detailing is gorgeous!

[Untouched24]

Hey, your stuff is looking pretty good. I much like the armor detailing in post #11.

As for critiques, I'd say in post #9 the characters right shoulder is a bit too far out/high up, but only slightly. At least it seems that way to me.

And like Maridius said, the guy's shoulders in post #11 seem a bit too broad, and as if the clothes he's wearing are too big for him. But I don't really know if that was a style choice, as I don't really follow manga/anime either. If so, just ignore me. Keep it up.

[Maridius]

Love the long, elegant fingers! I hate how mine come out clunky and yours are graceful and you picked a challenging angle to draw!

Before you get happy with details, double check the perspective. I'm not 100% sure it's correct (I suck at perspective). The shoulders seem too steeply angled if I'm looking slightly down at him--eye level is just above his head. I dunno. Draw a perspective line behind him and see if I'm dead wrong, then mock the hell out of me. Just don't change his face and hair. He's schmexy! I want to kiss his nose.

[clanlord]

See this man... http://www.scribd.com/word/full/9616...sgq15xcl8o761o I think it will help you...
-----
LEARN SOME MANNERS, clanlord Keep your crits to constructive criticism ONLY. I edited out the unnecessary parts of your post. See how much more effective it is now? Good. Use it as a model.
~Oreg.

[AShelton]

What I don't get: the specific exercises--I mean the people drawn in the boxes. I'm sure I'll get around to using them eventually myself, but I just don't get the point of boxing your people. :p If you could tell me (a few times as the question returns), either here or in FM chat, I would appreciate it.

The girl you drew=ENVY. I wonder what she's holding, but whatever it is, it looks dangerous. I want to be able to draw that well, and I like the detail, though all I can read of your note beside her is "Hair=[unintelligible] flaming.? Is she a character, or just something you just drew without knowing what you were really going for?

[Maridius]

So if I'm wrong I get mocked? Uh oh. Looking at the perspective boxes I'm wondering if I could be. I guess I need more work with it and maybe I'll fill a page with men in boxes. Did you erase your perspective lines? Sometime I can picture the lines, but more than that I have to see them on paper before I start.

And clanlord, if you come back to see this, telling someone their style is shit isn't polite OR the best way to interest them in Hogarth. Learn some manners before you comment again. Remember, we're all about CONSTRUCTIVE criticism here.

[AShelton]

Snitch, do you mind if I put that creature into some writing of mine?

Looks good, though the box is kind of wonky; looks like something out of Alice In Wonderland. As for the computer mouse and the puzzle piece, they seem okay; I don't understand what you have pointed to on the puzzle piece.

[xinranliu]

This is something that occurs quite often... Manga vs. Realism.

To me, Manga is much less appealing than art that tries to represent truth. I don't want to offend anyone, but I think that saying "Manga is my style" is just a lame excuse to avoid the hardship of realism.

To improve or not to improve?

To tell you the truth, I've been an avid amateur of Manga and Anime art. Just look at my old deviantart stuff... At that time I even told myself that I'll never ever touch realism art because that's just not me. Soon I realized that I was just afraid of going into an unknown territory. When I see great Manga art I think it's cool, but when I see a master's painting I think it's beautiful.

Things will change... eventually. Good luck!

[Snitchcat]

Heya, Ronald!

Thanks for your comments.

(^_^)

[Snitchcat]

It occurs to me that I need to explain something prior to posting any more work; and this is more rant than explanation. And if this makes waves, so, be it. Btw, no flames, no insults, and absolutely nothing impolite. This is my SB and I'd like to keep it to its purpose: sketches.

First:
I'm well aware that there are plenty of different styles out there. I'm also well aware that I have much to improve upon.

Second:
I have never, and will never, use such a lame excuse as 'Manga is my style' to avoid improving. Note that, please before any comments are made to any responses I might give about my love of Manga.

Third:
If you don't like Manga, fine, you don't like it. Just don't tell me I should get rid of it, or that it's 'shit'. Appreciate that there are those who like Manga, who like to emulate its style in some way. Appreciate that your style may not appeal to everyone else, either.

Fourth:
My plans for improvement are my own. Don't automatically assume I'm not working on anything else because all that's posted so far is Manga-influenced work!

Fifth:
Thank you for ploughing through this and for your patience.


Hmm... Guess this should also be at the beginning of my SB. Or, at least a calmer version, anyway. (Shall edit later to reflect that -- when I've calmed down, that is.)

[AShelton]

I almost posted about this before, but I decided to wait and let Snitch make her own response about it first. Not because I don't agree with her, but because hers was the art that was attacked.

Yes, attacked.

Insulting a particular style someone does, or saying that it shouldn't be done or doesn't belong, or that it isn't real art, is CENSORING. The fact is, Manga is just as much a real art as Speculative Fiction is real writing. And not just because there's a market out there for it. If you draw a picture, it's art. If you draw squares made of lines and try to shade the circles you draw to make them spheres, it's art. Even bad drawing is art. The first picture someone drew in the dirt or painted on the cave wall was art. Just as Heiroglyphics are writing, a specific style of drawing, painting, or graphic imagery is art.

No one should discredit or censor another's work. If the art is in someone's sketchbook, it obviously turns someone's wheel, and not just the person who drew it, and the truth is, Realism isn't the best thing to do all the time. Doing just one style is admitting fear in trying something new. Doing artwork is about learning new things.

[Snitchcat]

Quick sketch (I can see the improvement points):

[Maridius]

Believe it or not I sat here posing my arm like the girl in the last sketch to see if my boob would really form a vertical shadow under clothing and it did, so I can't pick on it that much, except to say you need more folds where she'd bunch it up between her arm and breast. The crown of her hair should also be visible at that angle, a little depression at the back to show the growth pattern. Other than than, this is a really sharp drawing and I love her pose! I have yet to make mine look this good.

[Snitchcat]

Thanks, Mari!

Points noted. I may work at home tomorrow, so I can also work on this sketch (I like it). (^_^)

[Snitchcat]

Had a little time tonight to make some corrections -- crown of the head, for one. Still working on the fabric folds between arms and breasts. Also need to add fabric folds between them. And the scarf to the right needs correction -- its bottom edge should follow the top contour of the breast, or at least, appear to follow it; it doesn't right now.

One other thing: seems like there's too much hair. And the largest highlight ring isn't curved enough. Hmm.

Anyhow, will ponder some more and fix more stuff.

In the meantime: progress so far:

[xinranliu]

I never said Manga is not art. And sorry I take the lame excuse part back, that was my own lame excuse can't put that on you.

And I clearly stated that I think good manga drawings/paintings are cool, especially H stuff :> but I just prefer more realistic stuff since that's just me. Clanlord was wrong saying Manga is shit, he's got to be more objective and less hurtful. He should have said that he doesn't like manga.

Jason Chan had strong manga/anime influences. He's one of the best and a featured artist on the top of every CA pages. He even said: "Now I am trying to marry my western art education with my eastern art interest and see what happens."

I'm not slamming your style, I'm slamming my own preferences. I tried to be subjective and civil - 'I think that', etc - in my last post but you were still offended.

I'm not a bad guy and I hate being called a jerk, prick, coward, bully more than anything else.

Gomen~

[Snitchcat]

Heh.

Never mind. (^_^)

[Cwn Annwn]

Hello Snitch, I see you're struggling a little with anatomy in most of your pieces. Don't be skeptical of anatomy books, they don't bite. It's natural to want to stylise your pieces in a way that is meaningful to yourself, but you do need to be a bit more familiar with the basics and framework of what you're doing *first*.

After anatomy books, have a look at photos and the people all around you so you can develop a sense of proportion and a sense of weight in your figures. This is applicable no matter how you want to dress up the final image.

Also in your pencil sketches, don't be afraid of trying out a larger range of values. Use a softer pencil if you must to get the full range of dark and light.

Keep up the practice.

[Snitchcat]

Hello Snitch, I see you're struggling a little with anatomy in most of your pieces.

<snip>

Keep up the practice.

Heya!

Thanks for the comments.

Yep, I have been struggling with it; my scepticism stems from the techniques used in the few I have studied in detail -- techniques that don't work for me.

But, was just looking through the Loomis books. Interesting discovery: I've been using his techniques all along. Just haven't gotten to the really in-depth stuff, particularly regarding anatomy.

Anyhow. Have a plan -- includes books, photos and real life references. (^_^)