Mac for art? Whats the big deal?

[Stuart DeViva]

So...how many people here endorse MAC over PC because it's so amazing at art? And why?

Seriously, so many "artists" of various kinds that I have met seem to say the same thing: Macs are the BEST for art related stuff!

But thats about it. I never hear why they are so good. I've played with the UI a bit on mac...I just can't see what the big deal is.

If I had to guess, I would say that it's just good marketing by Apple convincing all these "artists" that it's the way to go. But that's just a shot in the dark...

[Azu]

There is no big deal. It really just is good marketing on Apples part targeting ignorant people into believing their machines are somehow 'superior' for art/music/anything.

To be honest, its the exact same thing compared to a PC with the exception of the OS. A bit overpriced too.

[Ilaekae]

Whoops! Microsoft only thread...sorry. Didn't mean to interrupt...

--click--

[Flake]

It's just a legacy thing.

PS started as a Mac program, for a good while most print shops / graphic design places/ art schools were mac based. Because of this most graphic designers / print shop people / art students learned to use macs.

These days it makes no real difference.

Edit: Cue Zealots and Evangelists...

[rem92]

1.- Great monitors that show the colors like they should look from every angle you look at the screen.
2.- software for editing music or video

thats it, there is not really anything that would scream " Mac is for artist" about it, but the monitor quality its really a huge aid for digital painting .

[arenhaus]

Legacy PR, really. For a brief while Mac had been better at graphics than the IBM PC (which was more about business applications). So Mac had been the platform of choice for publishing (has remained, to a large degree) and Apple had been promoting that position and reputation of "PC is for boring office work, Mac is artsy" to a degree that's not even funny anymore.

Realistically, there is zero difference between what you get from PC or Mac graphic-wise or software-wise or compatibility-wise. Just reputation.

[MAtius Kesar, S.Sn]

Apple is 'High Definition' Company with 'High Definition' Products.

They create products like renaissance art in industrial way. They create products with standard, not just businesses.

Because they are company with artists work in with, they are company born by artists, really good artists.

[megaten]

They look pretty.

[eclectic rhapsody]

I dunno. For basic painting and drawing, I guess it wouldn't matter, but working on a mac as opposed to a PC saves you a whole lot of time when you're working on design related stuff and typographical stuff, or things that involve a lot of files in general.

It's much easier to manage files and to move them around when you're using a mac. Installing and uninstalling fonts can be done with a few mouse clicks, as opposed to a grueling cut-and-paste marathon with multiple loading screens. The desktop layout is neat and organized. Everything stays in the same place. On a PC there's tabs, tabs, tabs galore, constantly moving, constantly stacking, and constantly shrinking. And then there's that whole issue of not having the "authority" to change operations and programs on your own PC, even if you're its primary user.

Even something as mundane uninstalling a jump drive can be a gargantuan hassle. To start, open up the My Computer menu. Then, right-click your jump to bring up a drop-down menu. Select 'safely remove' from the drop down menu. Windows cannot safely remove jump-drive because it is in use by one of the many programs that you were working in and windows won't tell you which one. You want to be nice to your jump, so you will then proceed to shut down each program you were using, taking anywhere from 2 minutes to an hour to save all the documents you were working on. You will then attempt to remove the disk again, but as fate will have it, the file is in use by some invisible background program. Again, the OS will not tell you which one. You then have no option but to violently rip the disk out with your BARE HANDS. I cannot count the number of times this situation has happened to me. I've been using windows all my life, but it is sometimes stupidly uncooperative compared to mac on many different levels.

On mac OS, you drop the jump-drive icon into the trashcan and then the jump-drive is safely removed. Never a miscommunication. It usually takes less than ten seconds.

[jakobweiq]

Mac is more for desktop publishing.. PS is never meant for digital painting in the 1st place (correct me if im wrong)

with the radiculous price of a Core i7 Mac Pro, i can DIY a more powerful one w/ money to spare to get myself a car..

ok the car part is a joke..


but as of modern times, why stick to one when u can use two?
u got to make ur boss/clients (whether they r users of Mac or Win, or both) happy, right?


ok lets not forget abt Unix/Linux users

[Tikeo]

Nothing. Bought a mac hoping it would be good, but the only thing I see good is the organization of files. (color coded tabs, and search for files ) But for just drawing, painting, and stuff there isn't much to point to it.

I guess the fact that macs have a lesser chance of getting a virus is good. But that only implies that your surfing the web, and downloading illegal stuff.

[ikken]

So...how many people here endorse MAC over PC because it's so amazing at art? And why?

As a recent pc2mac switcher, all I can say is
1) mac versions of raster/vector software are generally better optimized. Photoshop, indesign, painter, illustrator - all that stuff is much more stable on mac. Sometimes faster. Sometimes not.
Painter 12 is crashing a few times per day for me, but painter IX I could hunt down works flawlessly, perhaps a lil bit slower on mac. (it's not even intel native application, can't be blamed.)
2) almost no trojans, no malware, little amount of viruses compared to PC. bawwww.
3) increasingly better wacom drivers. no pressure sensitivity bullshit issues, no half-assed releases. I don't know any bugless wacom driver releases for PC for the past 5 years - every version has minor (or major) screw-ups.
4) you can install windows on mac if you need it (bootcamp or parallels).


I guess the fact that macs have a lesser chance of getting a virus is good. But that only implies that your surfing the web, and downloading illegal stuff.
That can imply many things. A lot of blogs/websites/artist portfolios I visit daily were hacked in and infected with viruses at some point.

[Stuart DeViva]

Cool! Thanks for the responses.I was just curious. You don't know how many times people have said this to me. Everywhere I go people claim the brilliance of Mac for art stuff.

[viizi]

I use both mac and pc. I prefer to do everything on the mac except for games because of direct x. Mac is much nicer to work with and imo more stable. My Mac Pro case keeps things inside icy cold and very neat (screwless upgrades). If you want any proof just look at the market for software and hardware today. Everyone copies apples software and hardware designs to the point of getting sued to bits. Obviously Apple is the leader lol.

The only cool thing about doing art on the mac is it is much more stable and better file management / navigation. "It just works" is a very truthful marketing statement

[iMigraine]

As a recent pc2mac switcher, all I can say is
1) mac versions of raster/vector software are generally better optimized. Photoshop, indesign, painter, illustrator - all that stuff is much more stable on mac. Sometimes faster. Sometimes not.
Painter 12 is crashing a few times per day for me, but painter IX I could hunt down works flawlessly, perhaps a lil bit slower on mac. (it's not even intel native application, can't be blamed.)
2) almost no trojans, no malware, little amount of viruses compared to PC. bawwww.
3) increasingly better wacom drivers. no pressure sensitivity bullshit issues, no half-assed releases. I don't know any bugless wacom driver releases for PC for the past 5 years - every version has minor (or major) screw-ups.
4) you can install windows on mac if you need it (bootcamp or parallels).


That can imply many things. A lot of blogs/websites/artist portfolios I visit daily were hacked in and infected with viruses at some point.

I didn't know Wacom drivers on Windows were unstable? I've been racking my brain over buying a new (refurb) iMac 27" (replacing my faithful PowerMac G5) or upgrade my PC. At least I can try to play with each but I don't own Photoshop CS5. I really like OSX compared to Windows 7 but for gaming and ripping blurays, Windows 7 is the only choice.

[ikken]

@ iMigraine
I currently have windows xp set up through parallels to run painter 6, and wacom 493.3 driver from fucking 2005 or something. That is seriously the most stable release so far, but they aren't working with windows vista and 7. It also depends on your wacom model, I have intuos 3 and looks like they don't test its drivers enough since i4 came out.

I think you can install windows 7 either through bootcamp or through parallels, so I'd advocate getting an iMac.

[PasiJH]

For 16 years I only owned macs: Powerbooks, PowerMacs, iBook. I occasionally used pc's at work, but mostly I was a mac-only guy. For some reason I bought the Apple's hype that macs are just better and that they just work. I remember being amazed when I watched a movie on my friend's pc that had Windows 98 in it: how can that piece of crap play that movie as well as my three times more expensive PowerMacG4? I mean everybody said that Windows is just unusable.

I used Mac OS through 7.6 to Snow Leopard, and sure OS X made things very stable, but before that it wasn't stable at all. And it took a few rounds of OS X to make it usable and fast. I paid thousands and thousands of euros for mac hardware, and although couple of the machines were really solid I had huge problems with some. E.g. at university our class were given personal PowerBooks for our studies and if I remember correctly 60-80% of them had to be repaired during a couple of years, and that's a lot. My top of the line PowerMac G5 broke its motherboard couple of times and the graphics card twice, and it had other small problems, too. The lesson: Apple's hardware is NOT perfect, even if many people seem to believe that there aren't much flaws in it. It's just Apple's PR.

I haven't seen Apple as any kind of good company for years. All the bullsh*t that Jobs told just annoyed me. I mean the guy is a salesman. Yes he might be charismatic to some people, but in the end he just wants your money. So finally I decided to jump to linux but just as I was ready to make the complete switch Adobe came out with their new rules for student licenses that allowed them to be used for paid work, and I ditched the linux as a working environment, at least for now.

Windows 7 works very well with all the software I use in it. Sure there might problems with some programs but there were trouble with mac software, too, and there certainly hasn't been more trouble with the pc-software. I run the free avast-antivirus, but I never see it, and it doesn't bother me in any way. I've never had a virus on Windows 7 even though I'm certainly not staying on the sunny side of the internet all the time. My pc's don't randomly shut down and Photoshop and Painter 11 work very well on them; although I must admit that I don't use that much Painter nowadays. But I do remember that I had huge problems on my mac with Painter 11.

Apple's PR is perfect because they've managed to turn many of their users to mac-evangelists. I was one at some point and I'm so ashamed of myself now. I mean I was never too pushy but I certainly did make numerous small remarks how 'macs do this better'. /facepalm. And I always made sure to recommend macs to people who were contemplating a new machine. Now when I think of how much money I would've saved if I had always bought pc's I cringe a bit. Sure Windows versions before Windows 7 might have been in some ways behind their mac-counterparts but I've had tons of friends who were using pc's happily and not wanting macs. And now with Windows 7 things are just well. I'm happy knowing that I can update my computer easily with little money, or buy a new superfast computer with under thousand euros.

And someone who said that macs have better screens: I mean come on, don't be daft. You can connect any kind of screen from cheap TN's to the most expensive IPS's to pc's (and macs of course) and get just what you want. IPS-screens' prices have come down a lot during the last few years and that's a great thing.

So: don't believe the Apple hype :medusachow:

EDIT: I also have to say that even if OS X is slightly ahead of Windows 7 in usability the difference is truly very small, and probably there's really no difference for people who use their OS of choice a lot. I always had to use Default Folder X and other software (can't remember their names anymore!) on macs to make them more usable, but on Windows 7 I'm only using VistaStartMenu where I can see all my important software in one glance. And it's easy to move files etc. on pc, even though someone here earlier claimed otherwise. Many mac users tend to be a bit arrogant and defensive about their macs and easily spread false information because they don't really know how Windows works, or because they have some need to feel superior. And I don't mean people at this thread, just an observation from many years of being around.

[Darasen]

There a few few reasons that many artist prefer macs.

One is the legacy thing. Pagemaker pretty much started the desktop publishing business. The program ran on macs before it ran on windows. Additionally the macs were (if my memory serves) the only machines that properly rendered the measurements used in print typography. Macs were the first machines to most closely display colours on the monitor as they would appear in print.

Currently, many I know prefer macs because they simply work. certainly one can buy a $500 PC at Wal-Mart but that system is going to have a crappy monitor (if at all) and the OS is going to ship with several pieces of ad ware pre-installed. Trials for multiple software all launching on start up and then nagging to buy the full versions.

Apple doesn't sell a Mac with a cheap monitor.

A clarification from an earlier poster. Viruses are not the only Malware available. Malware sources can vary widely beyond illegal downloads and pornography, at one point the DRM on Sony musics CDs was actually malware. Macs stay more secure if for no other reason than there is no Widows registry or windows file system to exploit.

PS: I use Linux

[Ace Corona]

PS is never meant for digital painting in the 1st place (correct me if im wrong)



Can you please explain this statement to me? I plan on drawing comics on bristol board with pencil and ink, then scanning them and coloring them with Photoshop. I heard Photoshop is perfect for this task, but if you don't think Photoshop is suited for this, can you tell me what software is?

[joeparis]

I think he simply means that Photoshop was not designed primarily as a digital painting program; rather it's a photo editing program that just happens to have a wealth of painting tools. That's not to say that it's not the best all round digital image producing program ever! I prefer Corel Painter for painting but I use Photoshop for everything else. Photoshop is perfectly suited to your task.

[Ace Corona]

I think he simply means that Photoshop was not designed primarily as a digital painting program; rather it's a photo editing program that just happens to have a wealth of painting tools. That's not to say that it's not the best all round digital image producing program ever! I prefer Corel Painter for painting but I use Photoshop for everything else. Photoshop is perfectly suited to your task.

Thanks, Joe!

[Chipsterology]

Windows 7 works very well with all the software I use in it. Sure there might problems with some programs but there were trouble with mac software, too, and there certainly hasn't been more trouble with the pc-software. I run the free avast-antivirus, but I never see it, and it doesn't bother me in any way. I've never had a virus on Windows 7 even though I'm certainly not staying on the sunny side of the internet all the time. My pc's don't randomly shut down and Photoshop and Painter 11 work very well on them; although I must admit that I don't use that much Painter nowadays. But I do remember that I had huge problems on my mac with Painter 11.

Apple's PR is perfect because they've managed to turn many of their users to mac-evangelists. I was one at some point and I'm so ashamed of myself now. I mean I was never too pushy but I certainly did make numerous small remarks how 'macs do this better'. /facepalm. And I always made sure to recommend macs to people who were contemplating a new machine. Now when I think of how much money I would've saved if I had always bought pc's I cringe a bit. Sure Windows versions before Windows 7 might have been in some ways behind their mac-counterparts but I've had tons of friends who were using pc's happily and not wanting macs. And now with Windows 7 things are just well. I'm happy knowing that I can update my computer easily with little money, or buy a new superfast computer with under thousand euros.

And someone who said that macs have better screens: I mean come on, don't be daft. You can connect any kind of screen from cheap TN's to the most expensive IPS's to pc's (and macs of course) and get just what you want. IPS-screens' prices have come down a lot during the last few years and that's a great thing.

So: don't believe the Apple hype :medusachow:

EDIT: I also have to say that even if OS X is slightly ahead of Windows 7 in usability the difference is truly very small, and probably there's really no difference for people who use their OS of choice a lot. I always had to use Default Folder X and other software (can't remember their names anymore!) on macs to make them more usable, but on Windows 7 I'm only using VistaStartMenu where I can see all my important software in one glance. And it's easy to move files etc. on pc, even though someone here earlier claimed otherwise. Many mac users tend to be a bit arrogant and defensive about their macs and easily spread false information because they don't really know how Windows works, or because they have some need to feel superior. And I don't mean people at this thread, just an observation from many years of being around.

Pretty much wraps this thread up right there. After going to a few global Cut&Paste design tournaments and networking into a few design departments, or simply noticing the weapon of choice by many freelancers, I was going to hop over to Mac.....until Win7 came out. It offered a stay of execution which was the result of a few OS issues I had with 98/XP over the years, I mean, they let us d/l a trial of Win7 to use for a few months, what's the harm in trying it out? For me, it was like night and day. The exact same rig I built with more than adequate specs being hampered by the occasional BSOD or PC version crashes/bugs of the software I use seemed to silently disappear for the most part. I was actually getting more work done in the same amount of time because I didn't have to tend to any OS specific issues. Can't say Win7 is the Holy Grail of PC computing, but it certainly took nearly $7K worth of hardware/software migration costs out of Apple's hands just for me to switch over to them, made absolutely no sense. I can honestly say though, I don't see why a Mac user who's happy with the setup would have a reason to hop over to PC when they're getting their work done without a hitch also, but the reasons to "GO MAC" based on words alone these days is preposterous. Focus on what works for you hardware wise (quality of components, processing power, RAM limits on the MB, etc; ) and available software you need for the OS platform of your choice. Going Mac is more expensive, but if you are already versed in Mac only software to get the job done and feed your family, then the extra $$$ for a Mac will be dissolved into your income over time. Since this scenario hardly exists in the the graphic design/digital art realm, I see no reason why a person just starting out can't go Win7 with a quality hardware setup.

[Robellyn]

I don't think there is much of a difference anymore.

Now Mac's are generally easier to maintain (not too much playing around with hardware and OS settings) so if your main thing is doing your art and you don't want to manage a computer then maybe the Mac is better. The Mac also has thumbnails for most graphics types built in (so you don't need third party software like in Windows 7) which is great for managing your image libraries.

Windows 7 though works great for graphics too ... a little more work involved to keep the computer running smoothly, but all my favourite software (Painter, ArtRage, Photoshop (and a bonus! SAI!)) works wonderfully. If you're a Painter user, the Windows version is 64 bit while the Mac version is still at the 32-bit version. (You have to buy a third-party solution to show thumbnails for image sorting though).

I prefer to ignore the Mac and PC evangelists ... they can talk about which is better all they like. I just want my tools to work and to forget that I'm using a computer at all.