Self Environmentoring

[Sayanora]

Hello everyone! I've been an epic long time lurker here at CA and felt it was time I changed that.

I just finished reading through Form's enviro classroom from Oct 2007 and realized that's exactly what I needed to finally establish a good skillset. Form, I hope you don't mind my following along an old class of yours :) If you do, I can switch it up or something. Let me know if you happen to drop by.

So let's get started with Linear perspective. I'll work out the 2 and 3 pt sketches as the day permits, (work will get in the way until around 6) and then move on to the Observing perspective studies.

http://rottenostrich.trickyfly.com/Art_Training/1pt_a.JPG

http://rottenostrich.trickyfly.com/Art_Training/1pt_b.JPG

http://rottenostrich.trickyfly.com/Art_Training/1pt_c.JPG

This thread will largely serve to help myself learn, but I am very receptive to any input someone might have.

Cheers.

[Dile_]

request this to be moved to the sketchbook section.. that way more people will see your work and be able to help you forward.

I'm not sure if you doesn't understand how to construct simple things in perspective, or if it is that you're more advanced and therefore creating more complex forms ? Some of your stuff doesn't make sense as a 'basic' shape, but does make sense if it was a more complex one..you get me ? :p

try outlining every surface like a polygon in 3D , or add simple tones to suggest the forms .. that way its easy to see where you are and what to help you with ;)

good initiative ! keep posting :)

[Sayanora]

Long time no update :)

I'm diverging from the lesson plan that Form laid out, but I felt it was necessary. Maybe I'm jumping the gun, but here goes:

http://rottenostrich.trickyfly.com/cave_01_a.JPG

It's pretty rough and as you can see, there's no solid perspective happening here, just an isometric viewpoint for the sake of painting. I'll be returning to perspective studies soon.

[surfandsnow]

Not sure sure how much it will help, but I tried to do a paint over anyway. For my own learning if nothing else.

Thoughts
-you only used two values for the composition. you may want to add a region of white or a few other large regions of value(in terms of composition).
-No specific light source.
-No cast shadows, I know it was a quickie, but cast shadows help add depth and define forms its cast onto.
-Darken the rocks on the right to push them into the background. Having a darker value helps separate them from the rocks in the middle and adds depth.
-points where lines meet and intersect are important. How the edges of the steps are defined on the edges is more important than in the middle.

Something I learned/ reinforced.
-using lines to help show a plane
-forms overlap better and more distinctly when they interrupt lines.

Hope this helped http://www.conceptart.org/forums/images/ca_smilies/normal/smiley_bashful.gif

[Sayanora]

Dile:

Thanks for the input. I asked Davi to move my thread to the sketchbook section soon, so I can receive more critiques.

About some of my shapes looking off. I think you're right about them needing some simple tones to explain them better :) Hopefully my next ones don't have that problem.

surfandsnow:

Your comments are all valid and helpful. I've been stuck in 2d novice mode for awhile, so I always appreciate any input. You made my doodle pop way more and defined the edges of those steps much more. I should've worked on the broader values more before i started detailing a bit.

Being sick these past 4 days has taken its toll, but I've gotten back to doing perspective studies this evening. All 2 pt:

http://rottenostrich.trickyfly.com/Art_Training/2_pt/2_pt_a.JPG

http://rottenostrich.trickyfly.com/Art_Training/2_pt/2_pt_b.JPG

http://rottenostrich.trickyfly.com/Art_Training/2_pt/2_pt_c.JPG

Updated images with some simple tones

[Sayanora]

On to 3 point. 1 down, 2 to go:

http://rottenostrich.trickyfly.com/Art_Training/3_pt/3_pt_a.JPG

construction breakdown:

http://rottenostrich.trickyfly.com/Art_Training/3_pt/3_pt_a_2.JPG

[kikindaface]

Wow, really nice start ! You're allready using complex shapes to study perspective, it's really good ! I think for the 2 point perspective, you have to let more space between the 2 vanishing points, you know, if you put tham on the canvas, it will create too much distortion ! Try to do the second assignment, take 5 photos with perspective and find the horizon line and vanishing point, you will see that they are far from the image :p Keep at it ! hmm it's been a while that i'm interested by the form's environmentoring, i should start a thread like that .... :)

[Sayanora]

Walid:

Thx for feedback. I knew about the vanishing points being too close,(just playing with skewed perspective) but good observation. Something I'll take into account with more um, serious works. lol

Did one more:

http://rottenostrich.trickyfly.com/Art_Training/3_pt/3_pt_b.JPG

Forgot to post this too. Break from perspective sorta. I made this around the time I did that cave sketch.]

http://rottenostrich.trickyfly.com/Art_Training/path_a.JPG

[Sayanora]

Got some photo studies done

http://rottenostrich.trickyfly.com/Art_Training/Photo_Studies/study_03.JPG

http://rottenostrich.trickyfly.com/Art_Training/Photo_Studies/study_01.JPG

http://rottenostrich.trickyfly.com/Art_Training/Photo_Studies/study_02.JPG

[Sayanora]

pooped this quickie out a little while ago


http://rottenostrich.trickyfly.com/Art_Training/badgerfaceshroom.jpg

yes, its a mushroom growing out of his face!

[George Abraham]

Is there a way to practice free hand perspective, like for instance sometimes you can't draw your vanishing points (even if you put mirrors next to your canvas, Hehe).

What techniques are there to at least get it as close as possible when you can't reference an actual vanishing point?

[Sayanora]

zaorr: I'm fairly new to the subject myself, so I'm not sure if I can be too much help. A quick google search brought me back to CA (go figure:):

http://www.conceptart.org/forums/showthread.php?t=5623

That thread seems like it may have what you're looking for.

Quick gun concept:

http://rottenostrich.trickyfly.com/Art_Training/gun.jpg

Edit:

You might want to check out Scott Robertson's drawing dvds too. He covers perspective and freehand. Check it

http://drawthrough.com/dvds.php

[surfandsnow]

I may not be up to speed in the practical end, but I know the theory pretty well.
First of all theres a pretty good series on perspective here http://www.youtube.com/user/moatddtutorials

The most basic idea of perspective is that the closer something is the bigger it appears. If I have any doubts as to the perspective of something, I just imagine what would a ruler of fixed length look like in different areas. If the ruler if father away its going to get smaller, etc.

Something important to realize about vanishing points is that they only work as long as are parallel in reality(3d). Buildings roads and most man made objects are parallel so they vanish at a single point. If the elements are not parallel they will vanish at different points and the usefulness of linear perspective fades.

When sketching in perspective you have to draw every object relative to the objects around it. you also have to know how the object is oriented to the viewer so you can know how it will change in space.

You can also use 2d diagrams to simplify problems. Mark(link) covers most of this in his series.

End incoherent rambling.

http://www.conceptart.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=583335&stc=1&d=1233727899

"sometimes you can't draw your vanishing points (even if you put mirrors next to your canvas, Hehe)."

There is a simple way to create a vanishing point with out actually drawing it.
In essence you draw the horizon line then you draw the highest/lowest/most angular perspective line and then all the other perspective lines will "FIT" in between the horizon and the perspective line. I do this when I am sketching on paper. Sometimes I also sketch lines that flatten towards the horizon line and get more angular(like 2pt) the further they get away from it. Once the lines are sketched out I have a ground plane to work with and help me "see" with depth.

http://www.conceptart.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=583334&stc=1&d=1233727631

You messed up one of the two point cubes that went out of frame, I also had a few more thoughts.

http://www.conceptart.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=583336&stc=1&d=1233728021

Also, would you mind if I joined you in the enviormenting? I figure it might have a more "class" feeling to it if other people joined in. Your call.