I'm stuck, need help...!

[GaussianRaider]

It's supposed to be the stare of a jet fighter who's lost control.
The figure obviously needs polishing (mask and left eye are just sketched), problem is i don't know how to cast a realistic/interesting shadow map.
Right now there's no shadow/light, it's totally flat. (image 1)
It would be pointless adding details/polishing the rest of the picture without a coherent shadow/light.
I made in grey scale version (image 2). the blue arrow shows light direction, is that right?
What kind of illumination would make it interesting?

Thanks a lot if you stop by! :}

[rytango]

looks right to me, maybe have an ambient light source from the left, like moonlight and the green glow of the warning light to his right. some warning gibberish scrolling, "rounding" across his goggles would look very cool too!

[GaussianRaider]

looks right to me, maybe have an ambient light source from the left, like moonlight and the green glow of the warning light to his right. some warning gibberish scrolling, "rounding" across his goggles would look very cool too!

Woah, thanks!!! :O didn't come across my mind, that would be awesome! Sounds very ambitious, I'll try to set a layer for that later on! :D
Yep, i was thinking of moonlight too, that's why i shadowed it with dark blue tones! but what about the other cheek? i read about the "cool shadow -> warm light" stuff, i'm confused cause this scenario is "cool shadow (moonlight) -> cool light (green led)", what am i supposed to do?! :^^;:

[rytango]

hrrm, try making the cool light "hot" maybe. not as saturated, mix some yellows in it, over all don't go for a straight on green. make it as errie as possible. hope that helps?

[Hexokinase]

15 minute paintover

You had some anatomical problems. Namely, the lowest edge of the lower eyelids (the bags under the eye) were concave downward, which gave the impression that the pilot was smiling. Next, the eyebrows (though they were rendered amazingly) were too extreme. They were thick, and the arch was very unnatural - I've never seen anything like them. I addressed both of those issues in the paintover, and also changed the color scheme. In my opinion, this adds to the dramatic effect you were looking for, but you don't have to stick with it.

I added crows feet (the wrinkles to the sides of each eye) so that they matched the apparent age in the rest of the image. Returning to the eyebrows - I eliminated his angry expression and replaced it with one of shock and horror (which I would imagine being prevailant in such a dangerous scenario). I adjusted the mask a bit, to give it smoother edges and more of a jet-pilot look.

There are still some issues with placement that weren't addressed though. I also attached the guideline image to show how some aspects are off symmetrically. His pupils look a bit bug-eyed (looking outwards and not focused), so I'd want to fix that before rendering the pupils any further.

What I found odd though was that the greyscale image and the color image were 2 separate pictures. To get the values correct next time, try painting most of the image in black and white. Then, change your brush's settings to color (located at the top left), and add color to the black and white image. Then, revert the brush back to normal mode and continue painting. I personally like to use the Brightness/Contrast feature of photoshop at least once during the painting process to level things out (which I have done in this paintover).

You've got a great concept and composition with this image. Please keep us updated as you continue working on this image :). Oh, and if you wish, feel free to use this paintover as a direct starting point for continuing.

[Gina Salvador]

I agree with Havoc DM... basically if you want the light source coming from the side like that... then what is the pilot shockingly looking at? I think the controls should come straight from where his eyes are going as if he sees his controls or radar buggin out. Not only that but with the face... his left eye needs to be dropped a little more considering that his head is slightly tilted. Remember a picture is worth a thousand words.... lol... so... what's ur image trying to say? and then ask urself also... what will people get from ur image? When illustrator's create new pieces you always need to make sure that the audience understands exactly what's going on... the better u tell ur story... the more sense it will make! :)

[Gina Salvador]

Oh yeah one more thing... since the eyes are so up close! you can actually try making some detail in his eyes so we can see what he sees's.... like so....
<img src=<a href="http://photobucket.com" target="_blank"><img src="http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g174/rizztalah/eyeball.jpg" border="0" alt="Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket"></a>

Only not so extreme like the image.... but it would be fun to try!

[Kaete]

Well, knowing your anatomy is good, but knowing expressions is pretty key too - Havoc's overpaint unfortunately erased any and all expression from the guy. Instead of a balls-to-the-wall scream of rage, now it just looks like a fellow mildly surprised out of a daydream. No offence, Havoc, it's certainly more realistic, but it's also an entirely different expression. You can get screamingly angry and realistic at the same time, it just takes more effort. ;)

However, that's not to say Havoc's tips aren't correct! The eyebrows in the first picture are too circular. They start a too far behind and around the eye, and end a tiiiny bit close to the nose, even accounting for the muscle pull. I'd cut an eight of an inch of the inner nose side and half an inch off the tapered flare. Otherwise you're getting into ming the merciless eyebrow territory.

He's also right that the cheek bulges don't cover the eyelid, even in the most extreme case. It just squeezes them into a more horizontal line. I'd go a little more thin than the case in the overpaint, since in that their fullness adds to the dreamy look. Try staring at yourself in a mirror while making the same expression. I know *everyone* says this, but with an extreme closeup and expression, it's even more important.

Another thing that Havoc did but didn't mention - he added depth to the irises. Irises are not colors laid on top of the round eyeball. They're actually a small concave dip inside the eyeball, filled with a transparent liquid so they shade like water. At this sketchy point you may already be planning that, but I couldn't tell, so thought I'd mention it!

[Hexokinase]

Kaete - Thanks for the backing up:)
As for the expression though, I still stand by my paintover. I can't imagine anyone with such a fierce look of rage when they lose control of their jetfighter. I'd imagine a horrid shock and fear for one's life contributing to this expression. Either way I'm just being big-headed here - so ignore my banter:)

Your input on the iris is great, but I have to admit: I did not take that into account at all in the paintover (dumb luck I guess).

Gina Salvador - I agree, reflections in his eyes would be a nice addition - especially considering that the piece doesn't have a full head. The eyes are the most logical point of interest to emphasize.

[Kaete]

Kaete - Thanks for the backing up:)
As for the expression though, I still stand by my paintover. I can't imagine anyone with such a fierce look of rage when they lose control of their jetfighter. I'd imagine a horrid shock and fear for one's life contributing to this expression. Either way I'm just being big-headed here - so ignore my banter:)


Ohhhh. When I read "lost control" I thought he meant "went crazy" and just started shooting everything in sight! Yeah, losing control of the fighter would definitely be a different story.

[GaussianRaider]

Havoc-DM: Thanks, you really helped me a lot. Your paintover is amazing, after seeing that i thought "that's so good, i totally suck". :D
I ripped the concept for the mask from your paintover ;)!
I also changed the expression to a more frightened one.
I'll follow the method you suggested me, i'll try to use "colour" mode...am i supposed to colour it on another layer?!
The lightining scheme you suggested me is more dramatic, it fits better the mood.
I didn't change prospective (i noticed your version is frontal).

Gina: Nice suggestions! you are absolutely right, i'll make the light come from the front!
I made the picture enigmatic on purpose.
Who is the pilot? who is he fighting?
I wanted to leave that to audience's imagination, i just wanted to focus on the expression.

Kaete: Thanks for stopping by! When i started this picture i wanted to experiment with the "anatomic correctnes/dramatic expression" trade off, you know, bending the rules :P!
I tried to reject the "i'm going to die = fear" equation.
I was thinking to a complex feeling, a mixture of "fear, rage, frustration"...
"OMG I dont wanna die!"
"WTF! i'm gonna die, that @#@#@ shot my plane!"
"i can't die yet, gotta complete the mission!"
"That lucky ###@@! he can't better than me!"
But i failed :P!
So, here is a version with normal eyebrows :P! and another expression, i'll refresh the light scheme later!
Tell me if i gotta change something!

Thanks to all. :bashful:

[Hexokinase]

You want to use as few layers as possible. It's true that you lose some degree of control, but the whole piece will fit together if its done on one layer. Ideally, you'd want 1 layer for the character, and 1 for the background. In this piece, it can easily be worked with in 1 layer (which is what I did in the paintover). If you REALLY want another layer, keep 1 for the face and 1 for the mask.

Color mode only works within one layer. If you painted a red ball, and decide you want it to be blue, but don't want to shade from scratch, select a blue color, change the brush mode to 'color' (located at the top left bar) and paint over the red ball in the layer that the ball is located in. Once you're done, be sure to change the brush mode back to 'normal'. This technique is useful to change greyscale paintings into colored ones.

The lighting seems a bit 'one-sided'. As Kaete suggested, try using a mirror and a flashlight to see how the light would fall from that angle (it helps to do this in a dimly lit room). Remember to keep us posted, and good luck :)

[woo4]

Whow intersting Thread. Realism without loosing the impression. I'd never seen a jet fighter who looses control, but for me the first picture has the strongest impression, including this tryout.

http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z54/wool4/concept20forum201Kopie.jpg

I'd layed Havoc-DM's paintover (excuse) over your picture and put it on Hard Light (in english?) and followed most of the tips. But it loose impression too.
Cant wait to see how you solved this problem, and the question, what can we see in the eyes. Good Luck from me too. Till iforget, feel free to use this.

[Leftyy]

GaussianRaider, the first thing I noticed about the second version is the shape of the eye. It seems too long, and I don't know if that changes the expression but you might want to make the eyes less wide. The eyebrows are two completely different heights on his face so he looks confused rather than scared. His eyes seem to be staring in different directions. His eyes are two different distances from his nose. I would say make his right eye closer to his nose (about symmetrical to the left eye.) Then see if the two eyes are an eye width apart. If not, move them until they are an eye width apart but move them the same distance away from the nose. Once you do this, if it looks like the eyes are too far away from the sides of his head, I guess make them bigger or make the head smaller. Jeez, I hope that last bit made any sense.

Leftyy.x

[GaussianRaider]

Sorry for the small update, i have to study :nohope: :(!
Havoc: thanks for the tecnique, as you can see, i have to learn a lot about! :bashful:
Woo4: those colours are very vibrant! what do you think about the new expression? let me know!
Leftyy: pointing out all those anatomical oddities's been really helpful, i tried to correct the pic except for the eyes lenght/width, does it still looks wrong?

I'll change the light source as soon as possible, then i'll try some colours.
Thanks....

[woo4]

Thank you for asking, strong fear, to me as strong as the anger in the first drawing.
The mask for me looks much better now, more 3d, one thing i would change.
The highest light of the nose should be the highest light of the mask too.

I had to check up vibrand, but yes, they looking vibrand for me too.
Like staring into a Fire. I try this out by using this explosion stuff i'd made as Background for an other picture.

http://s188.photobucket.com/albums/z54/wool4/Explosion.jpg
http://s188.photobucket.com/albums/z54/wool4/concept20forum202Kopie.jpg

Good idea with the tube. i had'nt realized it in the Post befor.
How about ad some drop of sweat. For real.

By the way, have you seen this amazing "My1. Post" in the finished section.

[Jewl]

Why not have the best of both worlds?

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a55/jewlchu/Expressionexample.jpg

You know when people get struck with something really big, and their face doesn't know what to do for a few seconds? That's what I'm talking about. Fear AND anger. Baby.

Anyway, the "sweat dots" look like a lot of detail, but were really easy to do (this was a fast paintjob), and are a lot more subtle then a drop of sweat, although you can do that too. Anyway, take a big spatter brush (default photoshop spatter), make sure spacing + angle jitter is up, size the brush up some more, get default white, dot around the face a bit on a new layer, set the layer to overlay, use a low-opacity erasure brush to tone down the bits not highlighting, and voila!

Anyway, instead of (or in addition to) the green screen display, have you thought about a red warning button light thing? Then you could keep the moonlight and have warm opposing light.

[Fuzzy Modem]

You gotta blure that explosion reflection. It's so sharp I can make out the grain against the broader, softer lines of the piliot's face.

Can you go wider on the eyes? I'm getting "intesly interested in the situation" rather than "I'm so dumbfounded my brain froze up."